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Offline anonymouse

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Empathy and Privilege
« on: April 05, 2018, 01:21:06 AM »
I don't even know where I'm going with this.  It looks like an essay.  I'm just writing down my thoughts. Let me know what you think, how I can rewrite it to be more impactful. how I can shorten it.
(it's 11:20pm, I will re-read it tomorrow. my eyes are hurting)

===
Black Lives Don't Matter.  LGBTQ+ just wants attention.  Those are some things that people have said and keep saying on facebook and in person.
"reasons" given why people don't care about Black Lives range from discrediting the person and labeling them as a crook, a thief, a convict, on welfare, or "ghetto."  For LGBTQ+, some claim that something was already done and now they just want to "shove it down other peoples throats."
Let's stop with the ad hominem attacks. Let's stop with the ignorance, lets stop with the media driven idiocracy.
Empathy is what is lacking here.  Empathy is the ability to understand the feelings of another. It is hard to care about something which you don't understand what it's like to go through it.
For you, it may have been as simple as going "This is my boyfriend/girlfriend." But for many, they have to be careful who they introduce their significant other to, when they introduce their significant other, and consider how it can impact their current relationships.  There are communities out there who shun LGBTQ+.  They label them as disgusting, filty, incestuous, etc. There are people who believe that it's a disease.  And it's not uncommon for families to "disown" someone because of the person(s) they are dating or even the gender of the person they are dating. You didn't have to hide your sexual orientation or gender identity from the world.  You didn't have to keep it "in the closet."  For you, you were accepted as you were. 
For you, it may have been as simple as "taking a step outside and not having a care in the world."  But for many, they have to look outside  for their own safety.  They have to look over their shoulder.  They have to be careful of what they are wearing, what they say or how they look.  For some they have to be extra careful when they are being approached by or are approaching someone because of the color of their skin or their hair.  For some, people get tense and afraid just by their presence. 
I don't blame you for living life the way you do.  I don't blame you for not having these experiences. I don't wish for you to experience these things.  For many, they don't care, because it's not them.

Let's be clear. I identify as a Heterosexual Male, I use the pronouns, He, Him and His. So, yes, I don't have the same experience as my African American Friends, and I don't have the same experience as my friends who identify as Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transgender Queer/Questioning +. But Just because I didn't experience what they experience doesn't mean I can't empathize with what they go through.

Let me put a bit of perspective on this just so you have a glimpse of how/why I can empathize with their pain. I've been mistreated in the past for my height, my weight, my body shape, and because of my anatomy.  I've been told that I shouldn't wear a certain type of clothing. I've been told that people are uncomfortable because something on my body was "visible."  I've been insulted cause of my height.
When I go for walks, I often am aware of my surroundings and always making sure I am safe even though I feel that the neighborhood is relatively safe. It's happened before.
When I used to walk home from school, I did what I needed to do to make myself not seem like a "potential victim" of an assault.  This meant that I didn't wear jewelry, I didn't have my phone sticking out, I didn't have earbuds on. And one thing you should know about me, I love technology, gadgets and whatnot.
Even now that I'm no longer a student.  Before I enter specific neighborhoods in town, I call my siblings and inform them of where I'm going and ask them whether I should be careful of where I am headed.  Someone previously said I was "Judgmental" just because I was cautious.  I'm not "Judgmental" The reason why I do this is because there are places where I may not be "welcomed." Places where I shouldn't "Linger." Places where I should be careful because of a long list of reasons that can include anything from; my profession, my age, my race, my ethnicity, my nationality, my "accent" or lack thereof, the language I speak, word choice,  and so on.  These are very real occurrences.

Just because you have the privilege of not having to experience these things, does not mean that it doesn't exist. 




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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2018, 03:50:10 AM »
Perspective is important because it affects how you see the world.  Yes sure you are allowed to have your opinion and so do they but after the smoke is cleared, you have to understand what it is that makes us all unique.  It is our difference of opinion that makes us all unique.  Like for example, can you blame them for being different than you?  Who holds you binding that they must be like you or you must be like them?  It is this difference that makes you seems better or less than other people so once again, can you blame them?

So with that in mind, if you can feel for black lives matter, good for you. For others, they may not feel it but that's ok, difference of opinion right? 

Would your opinion be different if you got mug n left for dead by the same kaydoo that gives you such anxiety?  How ghetto is your background?  So we remember a pH member toua who is from Milwaukee and that guy hates kaydoo.  Free to hate but just don't act upon it.  I'm sure he gives a rat azz about kaydoo lives matter because truth be it that his own Hmong lives, he has yet to figure it out, how is he going to figure out this black movement?

There are way too many other stuff in this world to take upon and if you want to add the kaydoo stress in your life then that's you.  Maybe you live in a world where your future wife is kaydoo thus why you have to defend them.  I get it, it's ok but worrying yourself why other people don't have empathy in this arena?

Young grasshopper, we have a lot yet to learn. 

Too many factors involved and one of the culprit, I blame on the evolution of the human mind.  We used to care and hug everything including trees.  These days, we are picking to who we want to hug.  With technological advance have lesser us to be kind and humble towards other people.  We are changing because the world is changing.  We used to play hero but now, we just walk away from an accident because we think that the guy behind us will help out because our early morning meeting is more that important.  If everyone thinks this way, the poor guy will never get his help. 

I still believe in human capable of having empathy.  Just that we now pick and choose our battle.  I saw a YouTube video of this one chick, crying her eyes out because a duck only have one leg.  Poor duck but an hour later, it moved and dropped down two legs and walked away.  It is how duck sometimes post up by standing on one leg.  If she can cry that much for an animal, wonder what she will do with sad human cases. 

If I can find a clip to test your empathy, I'll share it.  I just hope it is still in my Facebook feed.  A Parent video their child with no arms and legs as he struggles to climb a stair of a slide at a play ground.  Be back in a bit.  I'll go find it. 


« Last Edit: April 05, 2018, 03:52:46 AM by DuMa »

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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2018, 04:12:48 AM »
Here goes the video which I think is a good video for a good critical thinking debate but we focus on empathy here. 

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SaEt7MWFcrQ



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Offline anonymouse

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2018, 09:27:24 AM »
I'll respond in full later since I'm at work.

You're doing exactly what I said at the beginning of the post. Take a step back. Reread the post entirely. Reread it several more times.  If you still think it's about black people. Keep rereading it cause you're missing the point.


« Last Edit: April 05, 2018, 09:44:04 AM by anonymouse »

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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2018, 09:46:59 AM »
I'll respond in full later since I'm at work.

You're doing exactly what I said at the beginning of the post. Take a step back. Reread the post entirely. Reread it several more times.  If you still think it's about black people. Keep rereading it cause you're missing the point.

I might not even talking about your point but talk in general to get other view points. 

Here's another point for you to consider.  Give us a black lives matter name and case.  Don't we feel empathy for dude that got shot? 

Now ask yourself, what about the black lives in Africa?  Where's the empathy? 



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Offline anonymouse

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2018, 08:24:30 PM »
Quote
Perspective is important because it affects how you see the world.  Yes sure you are allowed to have your opinion and so do they but after the smoke is cleared, you have to understand what it is that makes us all unique.  It is our difference of opinion that makes us all unique.  Like for example, can you blame them for being different than you?  Who holds you binding that they must be like you or you must be like them?  It is this difference that makes you seems better or less than other people so once again, can you blame them?
I already said I don't blame them. I don't want people to experience these things, but that doesn't mean you can't listen and try to understand where we come from. 
Here's where we differ greatly.  What you are saying is an uninformed opinion.  What we experience are real.

Quote
So with that in mind, if you can feel for black lives matter, good for you. For others, they may not feel it but that's ok, difference of opinion right? 
Not being able to empathize for what people experience is fine.  Throwing around petty insults, straw mans and ad hominem attacks are not examples of "difference of opinion" it's an example of ignorance. If you want to say you don't care about BLM. That's fine. If you want to say you don't like Black people. That's fine. I'm not going to argue against you on that.
But if you're going to speak from a place of ignorance. That part I will comment on.

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Would your opinion be different if you got mug n left for dead by the same kaydoo that gives you such anxiety?  How ghetto is your background?  So we remember a pH member toua who is from Milwaukee and that guy hates kaydoo.  Free to hate but just don't act upon it.  I'm sure he gives a rat azz about kaydoo lives matter because truth be it that his own Hmong lives, he has yet to figure it out, how is he going to figure out this black movement?
Having a bad experience with x number of Black people doesn't mean I should label all of them as bad.  Some of us are capable of looking beyond skin color.  What kind of question is that? "How ghetto is your background?"  I'm not even going to answer this kind of absurd question. I don't know Toua.  I'm not him.  How is he going to figure out the movement?
The same way everyone else does. and I recommend you do it as well.  Listen to what they say, listen to why the moment exist.  Listen before you talk. 

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There are way too many other stuff in this world to take upon and if you want to add the kaydoo stress in your life then that's you.  Maybe you live in a world where your future wife is kaydoo thus why you have to defend them.  I get it, it's ok but worrying yourself why other people don't have empathy in this arena?
Wow okay. It shows you didn't comprehend my post at all. It's not about black people. get that out of your mind. It's about having  empathy in addition to discrimination and injustice that people experience.   So we go from idiotic opinion to randomly inputting about someone's future as a way to demean, discredit and attack them? That's really something.
Again "The point of this thread is not about black people, it is about empathy and the discrimination and injustice that some people experience."
You don't get it at all. You still think it's about race. 

Yes, Yes. you have a lot to learn, but you won't be able to if you refuse to even listen.

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Too many factors involved and one of the culprit, I blame on the evolution of the human mind.  We used to care and hug everything including trees.  These days, we are picking to who we want to hug.  With technological advance have lesser us to be kind and humble towards other people.  We are changing because the world is changing.  We used to play hero but now, we just walk away from an accident because we think that the guy behind us will help out because our early morning meeting is more that important.  If everyone thinks this way, the poor guy will never get his help. 
Bystander Effect is not new. If injustice and discrimination is new to you then there's a problem.  This is not new.  Women's Suffrage existed for a reason. Women's Rights Movement exist for a reason. 
Elizabeth Cady Stanton. Rosa Park.Malcolm X. MLK. Little Rock 9. Oliver brown. Rodney King. Stone Wall riots. California Proposition 8.  We've always picked who we want to "hug."

Open a history book. Listen to a story.  Take a class.  Discrimination and Injustice are not new.

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I still believe in human capable of having empathy.  Just that we now pick and choose our battle.  I saw a YouTube video of this one chick, crying her eyes out because a duck only have one leg.  Poor duck but an hour later, it moved and dropped down two legs and walked away.  It is how duck sometimes post up by standing on one leg.  If she can cry that much for an animal, wonder what she will do with sad human cases. 
Do you have empathy? From this post alone, you don't. Believing it and having it are two different things.  But in order for humans to have empathy, they must be willing to try and feel how others feel.  We've always picked and chose our battles. 
Civil Rights. Women's Rights. Gay Rights.  These things aren't new.

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If I can find a clip to test your empathy, I'll share it.  I just hope it is still in my Facebook feed.  A Parent video their child with no arms and legs as he struggles to climb a stair of a slide at a play ground.  Be back in a bit.  I'll go find it.
Test your own empathy first. 

Quote
I might not even talking about your point but talk in general to get other view points. 

Here's another point for you to consider.  Give us a black lives matter name and case.  Don't we feel empathy for dude that got shot? 

Now ask yourself, what about the black lives in Africa?  Where's the empathy?
You might not even be talking about my point? @theking would call this backpedalling.
You are talking about my point. You talked about how I can empathize for others.  You talked about a "matter of opinion."  You talked about the world I live in.
You commented on the thread and replied to my posts.  That's you talking about my point.

Before you ask someone to consider one of your "points." Take a step back and consider what's already been said. 

Read up on the history of BLM. It's not a new thing.  The ideologies, the reasons why it began and exists, it's not new.  New name, not new reason.

Where's your empathy? You can't seem to look past the color of someone's skin.  You can't seem to look past the word "black."  This thread wasn't even about "Black", but that's the part you chose to zone in on just because it was mentioned.  You missed out on the purpose of the post and the rest of the message because you focused solely on that one word.

Before you want to "test" or question my empathy. Take a good look in the mirror.


« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 01:09:46 AM by anonymouse »

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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2018, 01:43:31 PM »
Well then.  I have one thing to say because I can't be typing a book off my Fon. 

You talking about empathy?  Where is your empathy towards me?  Don't you also feel what I feel as well?

Once again, I'm not talking about your point because I did not quote to dissect your point.  I can break my point down to further the talk but like I said, I'm on my Fon and too tedious to do such. 

You talking about your empathy, I'm talking about mine and blm is not on trial here.  It is only used to supplement my point, a point that you have missed if you want to see such point. 

Your first opening line.  You don't know where you going with this thus why I'm not attacking your point.  This is creative writing, freestyle free mode. 



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Offline anonymouse

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2018, 06:15:52 PM »
Rather than make a long post. I'll keep it short.  If you want to talk about your experiences go for it. If you want empathy for whatever you've experienced, tell us about your experience.

But if you're going to question someone's empathy.  Question your own empathy first, especially when you say something as absurd and ignorant as this about someone.

Quote
There are way too many other stuff in this world to take upon and if you want to add the kaydoo stress in your life then that's you.  Maybe you live in a world where your future wife is kaydoo thus why you have to defend them.  I get it, it's ok but worrying yourself why other people don't have empathy in this arena?

Hard to empathize with your weird belief that I take this stance because my wife will one day be black.  I don't empathize with that one.


« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 06:49:35 PM by anonymouse »

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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2018, 06:58:40 PM »
You want me to share my life story?  Well there are some truth to it.  Why do u think I am on here to defend the Hmong?  Because my future wife might be Hmong.

So there you have it.  I don't question just to troll.  Empathy that. 

You know what makes a good debate?  If you say hot, I say not then we can talk.  Nothing wrong with that.  You defend your stance of empathy and I refute it.  Nothing wrong with that as well.  The important thing to understand is that we are not on trial here. 



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Offline anonymouse

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2018, 08:08:22 PM »
You want me to share my life story?  Well there are some truth to it.  Why do u think I am on here to defend the Hmong?  Because my future wife might be Hmong.

So there you have it.  I don't question just to troll.  Empathy that. 

You know what makes a good debate?  If you say hot, I say not then we can talk.  Nothing wrong with that.  You defend your stance of empathy and I refute it.  Nothing wrong with that as well.  The important thing to understand is that we are not on trial here.
Honestly I don't know why you're on here.  Maybe cause you're bored like me, or just want to get some thoughts.  I come here either on my break, when I'm bored, or when I want to see how other feel about something.
That's where we differ.  But hey good for you for why you defend Hmongs because even Hmong people don't defend Hmong people.  Just know that, that is not why I have my stance on things. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if one day, my wife is white. Will she? I don't know. But if it happens, it happens.  It's not  why I think the way I do though.

It's up to you, If you want to tell me. you tell me. If you don't. you don't. 

I agree. debates are fine, it's where I used to go to, to learn.  If I'm wrong, by all means, educate me.  If I feel you're wrong, I'll let you know.  That's how we can teach eachother.   



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Offline DuMa

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Re: Empathy and Privilege
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2018, 10:54:32 PM »
I'm on the computer now and I have a mouse so I can quote you.  Let me try to work with what we have so far and how you read me wrong or how I read you wrong.  If it is wrong, allow the author to correct him or herself. 

Quote
Black Lives Don't Matter.  LGBTQ+ just wants attention.  Those are some things that people have said and keep saying on facebook and in person.
"reasons" given why people don't care about Black Lives range from discrediting the person and labeling them as a crook, a thief, a convict, on welfare, or "ghetto."  For LGBTQ+, some claim that something was already done and now they just want to "shove it down other peoples throats."

I followed it with just a philosophy of things by saying "Perspective is important because it affects how you see the world."

Again, I am not talking or caring about BLM issue.  I am saying that different people have different opinion.  If you can empathize for blm or kaydoo then good for you.  Some people can  not and they have their own reasons and their reasons are still within the law to do so. 

I follow it up with this "Would your opinion be different if you got mug n left for dead by the same kaydoo that gives you such anxiety?  How ghetto is your background? "

Here, I am not asking how ghetto you are but asking such question to show you that some people have a ghetto background.  Like ZDN and myself whom got robbed by a 10 years old kaydoo at gun point or Toua, former ph member who lives in a kaydoo infested city.  Such occurrences can have an impact on how one grows up and view their world.  Like a kid who loves fishing, good chances that they were exposed to such hobby at a younger age.  I am not saying that we are going to group all kaydoos together just because they did me wrong.  I am just illustrating a point that our views of some things are jaded because of our past.  If kaydoo don't do you no wrong in the past then perhaps that is why you don't understand.  I am not saying that it is wrong for you to grow up in a world far different than me or zdn.  It could be a reason why we don't care about BLM or any lives matter because no one cares about our own lives.  We are too busy worrying about our lives first to care.  Wrong approach but it is how we see it.  Matter of fact, I can even say that the criminal minded people care so for this BLM issue cuz they wanted changes cuz it could be them next.  People who don't care or care much are people who knows they are not going to get into a police altercation where deadly force will be used. 

Quote
Let me put a bit of perspective on this just so you have a glimpse of how/why I can empathize with their pain. I've been mistreated in the past for my height, my weight, my body shape, and because of my anatomy.  I've been told that I shouldn't wear a certain type of clothing. I've been told that people are uncomfortable because something on my body was "visible."  I've been insulted cause of my height.
When I go for walks, I often am aware of my surroundings and always making sure I am safe even though I feel that the neighborhood is relatively safe. It's happened before.
When I used to walk home from school, I did what I needed to do to make myself not seem like a "potential victim" of an assault.  This meant that I didn't wear jewelry, I didn't have my phone sticking out, I didn't have earbuds on. And one thing you should know about me, I love technology, gadgets and whatnot.

Here, one can say,  Cool story bro but did you get jack?  If you get jack enough, you might see it in our light. 

Now let me try to explain myself by quoting myself.  My fon has an auto correct feature so it might not look right.

Quote
There are way too many other stuff in this world to take upon and if you want to add the kaydoo stress in your life then that's you.  Maybe you live in a world where your future wife is kaydoo thus why you have to defend them.  I get it, it's ok but worrying yourself why other people don't have empathy in this arena?

Here i am stressing that there are other topics out there that is more important than this blm issue.  It is not because we lack empathy or incapable of.  It just that we or I find this BLM to be boring.  We might not even feel for the guy who got shot.  You make a dumb move, you die so why should I feel anything for you?  If a cop who is trigger happy or his lack of training and skip steps and shot an innocent man then sure.  Then again, we are letting the expert to paint us a picture to what really did happened for a better assessment. 


Quote
With technological advance have lesser us to be kind and humble towards other people.  We are changing because the world is changing.  We used to play hero but now, we just walk away from an accident because we think that the guy behind us will help out because our early morning meeting is more that important.  If everyone thinks this way, the poor guy will never get his help. 

Here, I am trying to link the strength of our empathy and where did it go.  With technological advancement, we tend to lose it.  Like at work, I was too busy typing on facebook or through ph while looking into my small phone that things around me at work were fallen apart and I say the hell with it, I'll deal with it later, ph is more important right now.  Had it was a person having a seizure, I would probably do the same thing too.  Internet browsing first so of speak. 

Was there a time when there were chivalry?  Now they say Chivalry is dead.  Now I say empathy is slowing dying.  Evolution of the mind have jaded us.  How about the case of the good Samaritan being dead for having empathy?  This case here was my local town case and is just last month I think.  Kaydoo lady having empathy and stopped to helped out a car accident victim and a corvette comes flying by and took her and her partner out.  She fell down the bridge and into the river where her body went missing. 
http://fox40.com/2018/02/27/body-of-stockton-good-samaritan-found-in-water-under-i-5/

Cases like this is why I say that empathy is slowly dying.  I'm not playing hero.  If I see something, I will call the cops first and record for youtube later.   :2funny:

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Here goes the video which I think is a good video for a good critical thinking debate but we focus on empathy here.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SaEt7MWFcrQ

Here, I wanted to stress another empathy test.  You feel for that kid who is struggling?  What kind of mother would sit there and film their child struggling like that?  ah ha, perhaps the child have done it many times and passed thus why the mother allows the armless and legless child to do what other kids can also do.  This is to show her son that he is normal and capable. 




« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 10:59:19 PM by DuMa »

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