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Author Topic: Is Jesus God?  (Read 2888 times)

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Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2018, 10:52:07 PM »
What about this passage.

Mark 10:17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. "Good teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
Mark 10:18 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone.
Mark 10:19 You know the commandments: 'You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.' "
Mark 10:20 "Teacher," he declared, "all these I have kept since I was a boy."
Mark 10:21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. "One thing you lack," he said. "Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
Mark 10:22 At this the man's face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
Mark 10:23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!"
Mark 10:24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of God!
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for the rich to enter the kingdom of God."
Mark 10:26 The disciples were even more amazed, and said to each other, "Who then can be saved?"
Mark 10:27 Jesus looked at them and said, "With human beings this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God."
Mark 10:28 Then Peter spoke up, "We have left everything to follow you!"
Mark 10:29 "Truly I tell you," Jesus replied, "no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the gospel
Mark 10:30 will fail to receive a hundred times as much in this present age: homes, brothers, sisters, mothers, children and fields--along with persecutions--and in the age to come eternal life.
Mark 10:31 But many who are first will be last, and the last first."

After carefully examined this passage it appears the Rich man understood Jesus. He started out saying "good teacher" but after Jesus corrected him, he said "teacher" only (verse 20.)

What are your guys thoughts on this?



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

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Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2018, 04:41:41 AM »
Good point. I think Jesus is the "son of David" while not physically descendant, but by his adopted father Joseph. Adoption still counts, and Joseph is descendant from King David.

I am still puzzled about Mary's genealogy though. Remember Jesus still has a blood line through her mother Mary. We're told she's Elizabeth's cousin who is from the tribe of Levi since her husband Zachariah is a priest and it's common for people to married their own tribe. If she and Mary are both cousins & she's from tribe of Levi, I'm assume Mary is also from the tribe of Levi?

Mary came from the Levi side who came from Nathan, the son of King David. 

Joseph came from the other son Solomon. 

Mary's mom came from Levi who came from Aaron thus puts the connection that jesus Christ came from a line of a priest. 

Matthew's writing was to the Jews and to show them that through Joseph, Jesus came from the King David line. 

Luke on the other hand was written to the Greek which emphasis the king David line plus beyond how it traces back to Adam and god.  His focus is to show that Jesus is the redemption that will save all mankind tracing it all the way back to Adam. 

Key points to remember.  Jewish custom omit female names from genology.  Mary was included only because her parents had her as the only child.  Some may argue that Luke is also written with Joseph in mind since it was established that Joseph is indeed from the line of David.  Well if that is the case then both Matthew's and Luke genology should be the same.  We find that it is until it gets split after king David.  This to me shows that one guy is showing Joseph's line while the other shows unknown person's line.  You can debate who this other person is but to me, the only person closest I can relate to is Mary the biological mom of Jesus Christ which shows him coming from the line of royalty. 

One last thing I wanted to point out.  Do notice which genology line is the better line.  One line ran from Solomon to Joseph, the other from Nathan to Mary.  There is a purpose to see a distinction here.  The people coming from Solomon, including himself have issues.  The people coming from Nathan are pure.  If you are god to be born, which sperm line would you rather be in?  This is important to know and perhaps why Jesus should be born of a virgin to stay pure himself.  That pure line is the only one that traces back to Adam and back to god. 

So is Jesus god?  From genology of God and ends with God.  Check mate. 






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Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2018, 04:52:14 AM »
What about this passage.

Mark 10:17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. "Good teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
Mark 10:18 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone.
Mark 10:19 You know the commandments: 'You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.' "
Mark 10:20 "Teacher," he declared, "all these I have kept since I was a boy."
Mark 10:21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. "One thing you lack," he said. "Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
Mark 10:22 At this the man's face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
Mark 10:23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!"
Mark 10:24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of God!
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for the rich to enter the kingdom of God."
Mark 10:26 The disciples were even more amazed, and said to each other, "Who then can be saved?"
Mark 10:27 Jesus looked at them and said, "With human beings this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God."
Mark 10:28 Then Peter spoke up, "We have left everything to follow you!"
Mark 10:29 "Truly I tell you," Jesus replied, "no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the gospel
Mark 10:30 will fail to receive a hundred times as much in this present age: homes, brothers, sisters, mothers, children and fields--along with persecutions--and in the age to come eternal life.
Mark 10:31 But many who are first will be last, and the last first."

After carefully examined this passage it appears the Rich man understood Jesus. He started out saying "good teacher" but after Jesus corrected him, he said "teacher" only (verse 20.)

What are your guys thoughts on this?

There are plenty of areas in the ot where he seems to deny his godly stance. 

From what I think I know, he is god in the flesh as Jesus Christ.  He is also human as we saw him bleeding and suffering like a mortal on the cross.  Because of this, he does not want to be seen as the god just yet. 

Reference to the scene before his resurrection when he appears to his disciples and one of them realized that it was him and wanted to hug him but he told dude not to touch him as he is not yet morphed to that super sain level just yet.  When you are human, you are still constraints of the human laws if nature.  If this is so, you are not yet a god for God is beyond the realm of all constraints. 




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Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #18 on: May 13, 2018, 03:09:41 AM »
Mary came from the Levi side who came from Nathan, the son of King David. 

Joseph came from the other son Solomon. 

Mary's mom came from Levi who came from Aaron thus puts the connection that jesus Christ came from a line of a priest. 

Matthew's writing was to the Jews and to show them that through Joseph, Jesus came from the King David line. 

Luke on the other hand was written to the Greek which emphasis the king David line plus beyond how it traces back to Adam and god.  His focus is to show that Jesus is the redemption that will save all mankind tracing it all the way back to Adam. 

Key points to remember.  Jewish custom omit female names from genology.  Mary was included only because her parents had her as the only child.  Some may argue that Luke is also written with Joseph in mind since it was established that Joseph is indeed from the line of David. Well if that is the case then both Matthew's and Luke genology should be the same.  We find that it is until it gets split after king David.This to me shows that one guy is showing Joseph's line while the other shows unknown person's line.  You can debate who this other person is but to me, the only person closest I can relate to is Mary the biological mom of Jesus Christ which shows him coming from the line of royalty. 

One last thing I wanted to point out.  Do notice which genology line is the better line.  One line ran from Solomon to Joseph, the other from Nathan to Mary.  There is a purpose to see a distinction here.  The people coming from Solomon, including himself have issues.  The people coming from Nathan are pure.  If you are god to be born, which sperm line would you rather be in?  This is important to know and perhaps why Jesus should be born of a virgin to stay pure himself.  That pure line is the only one that traces back to Adam and back to god.


It is possible that both are Josephs as per your explanation. It is also possible that one is Joseph and the other is Mary's because of omitting.

So is Jesus god?  From genology of God and ends with God.  Check mate.

I think the genealogy is great to show Jesus as the Messiah, but it's not good to use it to show as God.



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #19 on: May 13, 2018, 10:17:48 PM »



 

It is possible that both are Josephs as per your explanation. It is also possible that one is Joseph and the other is Mary's because of omitting.

I think the genealogy is great to show Jesus as the Messiah, but it's not good to use it to show as God.


After jesus died and before his resurrection, he appears to Thomas.  Thomas did not believe that it was Jesus so Jesus told him to touch his wounds. 

Right and then, Thomas believed and said my Lord and my God.

Now if we know Jesus, he is a teacher, a preacher and what does he normally do?  He corrects people.  Why did he not corrected Thomas?  Unless he is.   


« Last Edit: May 13, 2018, 10:21:04 PM by DuMa »

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Offline Visualmon

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #20 on: May 14, 2018, 01:15:31 AM »
If y'all wanna know if Jesus is God then the question should be "Have you met him in person?" other than getting info from the bible.  :2funny: :2funny:



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Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #21 on: May 14, 2018, 02:45:11 AM »
If y'all wanna know if Jesus is God then the question should be "Have you met him in person?" other than getting info from the bible.  :2funny: :2funny:

They believed in a dead man of the past and that is why it is so interesting. 

Either there is some truth in it or this religion, this God is that powerful that he she it still flourished after the hype is over. 



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Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #22 on: May 14, 2018, 07:52:25 AM »

After jesus died and before his resurrection, he appears to Thomas.  Thomas did not believe that it was Jesus so Jesus told him to touch his wounds. 

Right and then, Thomas believed and said my Lord and my God.

Now if we know Jesus, he is a teacher, a preacher and what does he normally do?  He corrects people.  Why did he not corrected Thomas?  Unless he is.

Right... the JW will say my Lord referring to Jesus and my God referring to the Father.  :2funny:

Paul even says in 1 Corinthians 8:6 "yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live."

So God, the Father, is distinguish from the one Lord, Jesus Christ.

Also remember, it is God who made Jesus Lord.



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #23 on: May 14, 2018, 11:35:10 AM »
lol

is jesus aka the hmong yer shao???
or muslim, allah?
gotta be shiva from hindi

oh wait
there too many gods

how do i know which god is right

lol

i just do what people say and tell me

I don't know if they are the same. Do you have any article or reference we can compare yer shao to Jesus? Start there.

Regarding Allah, that's been done before.



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #24 on: May 14, 2018, 11:47:05 AM »
Right... the JW will say my Lord referring to Jesus and my God referring to the Father.  :2funny:

Paul even says in 1 Corinthians 8:6 "yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live."

So God, the Father, is distinguish from the one Lord, Jesus Christ.

Also remember, it is God who made Jesus Lord.

There are a bunch of references where the god of the old testament is spoken like Jesus of the new testament.

I'm not on my computer but this is a start. 

In Isaiah 44:6, the LORD (Yahweh) refers to himself as “the First and the Last”. In Revelation 1:8 and 17, Jesus similarly refers to himself as “the Alpha and the Omega” and “the First and the Last”.

https://margmowczko.com/proving-that-jesus-is-god-from-the-old-testament/



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Offline hmgROCK

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #25 on: May 14, 2018, 01:18:35 PM »
I don't know if they are the same. Do you have any article or reference we can compare yer shao to Jesus? Start there.

Regarding Allah, that's been done before.

Lol

Zeus is a god
Don’t see people talking about him nowadays
Funny



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Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #26 on: May 14, 2018, 02:00:29 PM »
There are a bunch of references where the god of the old testament is spoken like Jesus of the new testament.

I'm not on my computer but this is a start. 

In Isaiah 44:6, the LORD (Yahweh) refers to himself as “the First and the Last”. In Revelation 1:8 and 17, Jesus similarly refers to himself as “the Alpha and the Omega” and “the First and the Last”.

https://margmowczko.com/proving-that-jesus-is-god-from-the-old-testament/

While I do believe the Bible is inspired, I also try look at it from a translation process.

It goes something like this if I remember the history behind it. Some Jews translated the OT Hebrew into the Greek known as the Septuagint, and when they did this, they took
what belongs to Yahweh and attributed it to Christ. I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the topic, but I have a feeling it's a similar situation here. Do correct me if I'm wrong.



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Offline DuMa

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #27 on: May 14, 2018, 02:23:50 PM »
While I do believe the Bible is inspired, I also try look at it from a translation process.

It goes something like this if I remember the history behind it. Some Jews translated the OT Hebrew into the Greek known as the Septuagint, and when they did this, they took
what belongs to Yahweh and attributed it to Christ. I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the topic, but I have a feeling it's a similar situation here. Do correct me if I'm wrong.

It is who he say he is or that he's verse in the old testament since he too had to learn it for he is still a Jew.  Once learned, one can receive what the god of the old testament saids. 

But if that is the case, why did Jesus not get prosecuted by the old testament god? 

Somewhere in the new testament that shows what's being translated must be accurate.  So those who translate must be smart and educated because not all can read and write plus they must have money cuz a paper and pen at the time isn't cheap either.  What is being translated is accurate but later on, words lose it's meaning through many other prints of translation.  Does it makes a difference? Absolutely.  Like some says heaven when other says paradise.  Contradictory?  Looks like it but the culprit is the wording through translation that is being falsely representing. 



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Offline Visualmon

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #28 on: May 15, 2018, 03:24:20 AM »
What about this passage.

Mark 10:17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. "Good teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
Mark 10:18 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone.
Mark 10:19 You know the commandments: 'You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.' "
Mark 10:20 "Teacher," he declared, "all these I have kept since I was a boy."
Mark 10:21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. "One thing you lack," he said. "Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
Mark 10:22 At this the man's face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
Mark 10:23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!"
Mark 10:24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again, "Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of God!
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for the rich to enter the kingdom of God."
Mark 10:26 The disciples were even more amazed, and said to each other, "Who then can be saved?"
Mark 10:27 Jesus looked at them and said, "With human beings this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God."
Mark 10:28 Then Peter spoke up, "We have left everything to follow you!"
Mark 10:29 "Truly I tell you," Jesus replied, "no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the gospel
Mark 10:30 will fail to receive a hundred times as much in this present age: homes, brothers, sisters, mothers, children and fields--along with persecutions--and in the age to come eternal life.
Mark 10:31 But many who are first will be last, and the last first."

After carefully examined this passage it appears the Rich man understood Jesus. He started out saying "good teacher" but after Jesus corrected him, he said "teacher" only (verse 20.)

What are your guys thoughts on this?

I'm sure JW don't understand what verse 25 and verse 29 really mean. So they just pause and think then create a false scenario for us to fall for.   ;D ;D

Like I said earlier the fake read the passages from the bible claiming they know Jesus and his father but haven't met them in person or Jesus haven't manifest himself in front of them. The book itself portray that the disciples TRULY met Jesus including the Jews and Greek, not those 21 century buffoons.  ::)



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Offline Yengimer

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Re: Is Jesus God?
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2018, 09:41:00 AM »
It is who he say he is or that he's verse in the old testament since he too had to learn it for he is still a Jew.  Once learned, one can receive what the god of the old testament saids. 

But if that is the case, why did Jesus not get prosecuted by the old testament god? 

Somewhere in the new testament that shows what's being translated must be accurate.  So those who translate must be smart and educated because not all can read and write plus they must have money cuz a paper and pen at the time isn't cheap either.  What is being translated is accurate but later on, words lose it's meaning through many other prints of translation.  Does it makes a difference? Absolutely.  Like some says heaven when other says paradise.  Contradictory?  Looks like it but the culprit is the wording through translation that is being falsely representing.

I'm not sure about that. It may or it may not.

Let's look at a different example. The translator or Matthew would have mistranslated the prophecy in Isaiah regarding the young woman.
In the Hebrew it would be Almah. If Isaiah wanted it to be a virgin, he or the author would have it say betulah.  How do we know this? Look up the Hebrew Text and see what it says, then do a word search and see what it mean. You'll find that most modern bible render it virgin which is wrong.

What do you think about this?



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John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

 

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