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Mark D
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« on: September 10, 2007, 10:41:03 PM » |
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Anyone remember who posted these charts on the Pajntaub alphabet? 
The following was added by our PH Moderators:
Note: The surrounding paj ntaub art is made up of individual symbols that can also be found in the charts. Same goes with traditional Hmong flower cloth.
Picture #2 removed to save space.
This link should take you to a larger version of the image: http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x101/ThaNeng/3HmongWritingSounds.jpg
FAQ
Q: Is this the written language Shong Lue Yang put together? The one the Chao Fa use? The one also known as the Pahawh Hmong Alphabet?
A: No, this is the ancient Hmong writing system the Hmong queen requested to be preserved on the flower cloth (paj ntaub) when defeat of the Hmong Kingdom was known to be inevitable. Elders stress this Hmong Kingdom was known as the Chu Kingdom in Chinese History books, but until more evidence can be found we can only call it a "theory".
More information on Shong Lue Yang's writing can be found here: http://www.omniglot.com/writing/hmong.htm
Information on other writing systems for the Hmong can be found here: http://hmoobvwj.com/qauv/ntawv/hmoob/index.php (They seem confused as to who made which and when)
Q: When was this writing created and by who?
A: The elder who drew up the images to help the new generations understand says it was already in use when the first wars broke out between the Chinese and Hmong. Earliest war is estimated around 2700-3000BC. (Approximately 5,000 years ago). Exactly who invented it we don't know, it's possible ancient sciptures, scrolls, or books still hold this writing but we haven't come across any yet.
Quick Facts
As noted by Mark D "rau siab kawm ntaub, kawm ntawv" today means "do well in school" but it translates into English as "learn the cloth, learn the writing"
A discussion about the Chu Kingdom is taking place here: http://www.pebhmong.com/forum/index.php?topic=51504.0
Further discussions about this writing system is taking place here: http://www.hmongza.com/index.php?showtopic=17512 |
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« Last Edit: July 08, 2008, 03:15:24 PM by Swordplay »
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madcow
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cow power
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« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2007, 05:27:24 PM » |
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Is this the same as ntawv hmoob koos haum?
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LeLaaay
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« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2007, 03:25:57 PM » |
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i remember learning this alphabet when i was a little girl.
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LeLaaay
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« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2007, 02:59:09 PM » |
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Where were they teaching you?
in stpaul, mn at this building. |
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LeLaaay
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« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2007, 07:48:13 PM » |
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Ah okay someone did tell me about a place in MN that taught it, I remember now. I take it they don't teach it anymore?
No they don't. I remember as a little girl in grade school learning it on the weekends only. |
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HmongKnight
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« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2007, 10:25:59 AM » |
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What year were these Hmong ancient alphabets written and by whom?
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Mark D
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« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2007, 03:40:09 PM » |
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What year were these Hmong ancient alphabets written and by whom?
Not sure exactly, but I think they're pretty ancient...like ly around the time when the Hmong were enslaved and were not allowed to read or write...but luckily the women hid the alphabet in their clothes and textile arts so that future generations may know... This is probably why the elders keep on telling you to "rau siab kawm ntaub, kawm ntawv". |
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LeLaaay
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« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2007, 12:08:22 PM » |
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This is probably why the elders keep on telling you to "rau siab kawm ntaub, kawm ntawv".
I agree. I get yelled at all the time.  |
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LeLaaay
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« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2007, 12:09:05 PM » |
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Shongku- Wow, that's very interesting cause in the Hmong paj ntaub there's that curly e sign in it.  |
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A_New_Beginning
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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2007, 08:41:24 PM » |
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Brother Shongku, keep up with your research. If you do find anything more let us younger brothers and sisters know.
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A_New_Beginning
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« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2007, 09:02:42 PM » |
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Is this the same as ntawv hmoob koos haum?
Ntawv Hmoob Koos Haum are originate by Shong Lue Yang during the Vang Pao Era. According to my father and a few uncles Shong Lue Yang was killed by Vang Pao due to fear of the Communism China. Ntawv Pajntaub is our Hmong's ancient written system develop in the BCs era, when our great Txiv Yawg was still in command and China is not even China yet. If you pay attention carefully to our Hmong's Kabtshoob KevKos, Kevcai Ploj tuag you'll hear the message in there. I know, to us it's just plain songs but listen carefully and you'll get our full history. |
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zoov
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« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2007, 08:28:36 PM » |
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hm...where can i get more inform on this??? is it traditionally passed down by the older women?
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"The five colors blind the eye
The five tones deafen the ear
The five flavors dull the taste."-Laus Txuj
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Swordplay
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« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2007, 01:16:05 AM » |
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hm...where can i get more inform on this??? is it traditionally passed down by the older women?
Yep that's the one. I know the person working on those charts, he can read/write it. If you'd like to meet them or talk to them on the phone send me a private message. |
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Midnight_Reflection
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« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2007, 12:24:57 PM » |
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It'll be interesting to learn these alphabet.
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Havnim
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« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2007, 05:43:04 PM » |
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But I thought these were used by cov "caubfab" to communicate about military strategies only and has nothing to do with "ancient Hmong language". Or am I assuming too much here? Or are we talking about two different form of writing?
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