PebHmong Discussion Forum
Relationship => General Relationship => Topic started by: DuMa on October 24, 2018, 11:32:43 AM
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How can a couple marries one another and not wanting to have children?
I can understand if they waited it out for the right time but seeing 0 children down the line just confuses me even more.
Congrats to Rosie O'Donnald on her wedding to another woman but still, even the homo has 5 adopted kids.
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I get this ALL THE TIME because I choose to be child free!
They: When are you going to have kids?
Me: I don't want any
They: Why? You don't know what real love is unless you have children of your own
Me: I know what real love is, I love my husband, my family, my friends
They: You'll change your mind
Me: No, I know what I want and I don't want kids
They: But what if your husband want kids?
Me: We talked about it way before we even got into a serious relationship, we don't want kids
They: So you don't like kids?
Me: I'm the oldest of 10, I have many nieces and nephews, I love kids and a great Auntie to all of them, just don't want any of my own
They: You're just selfish
Me: Nothing selfish about knowing what I want and sticking to it then to conform to society. There are plenty of parents out there that can't provide a good home for their children, plenty of mom that abandon their child. I don't want to bring a child into this already messed up world.
Everyone is different, can't expect everyone to want the same thing in life. And happiness for someone does not necessarily mean happiness for someone else.
Weird but i hear the same excuse coming from you like theirs too. Kind of makes you think if your idea is unique or are you a Droid battling from the otherside which defeats the purpose of following what other people may say.
It is not a question of you wanting a kid but kids can't have kids. You still a kid yourself and kids shouldn't be playing grown up games either. I'd stay committed friendship if that was the case.
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The right to have children is a personal one for each individuals and I do get it however, there is still the wise tale brought to you by them elders and I am not saying that their golden rule is right or wrong but I do say that they do make a point to be noted.
A coworker of mine took his package of 50k for retiring this year. Hes 62 and I would say he have lived the life before me. He said he came to America to seek the American dream, one where no one handed him the handbook of life. Cars he buy yes but houses he did not. Now he is retiring with nothing and regretting not planning for his future.
There is a point in his story and message here. What if your so called life is not well thought out? People I know that have a successful marriage all gone through these seminar where the counselor would test and drill them with questions to see if they are marriage and beyond ready.
My thought is this. Having children is not a burden but an insurance policy on your behalf. Now imagine our elders who are old and have no children of their own, what their life would be like without having someone like their own kids to watch out for. I'm for sure your cousins are not going to babysit you for they have their own elders to cater to. You will then be in an old people home with nobody to lift up your spirit.
If you accept this then that's fine but always understand what you are getting yourself into.
If I even pull up the math in regards to your age then things will get more scarier. Like there is a cut off age where once you miss the train, you would have missed it.
Even myself is worrisome. My math shows me that the rate I'm going, I might not be able to see my grandkids.
No one teaches this but the math don't lie. Being old and die lonely should be a phobia.
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Some say they are saving their virginity for marriage but really now, they are saving it for college.
You might end up with the unthinkable as there are babies in this world are a product of an accidental. You Hmong? You highly fertile. Genetics don't tend to lie, especially when you came from a high litter.
So instead of saying you don't want children. Just say you are normal by trying but nothing yet.... for a very long time.
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We both do not have children of our own now. My reasons to not wanting kids may be different than yours but the pressure is there for you since you are married.
We can write big list to why it is not a good idea to have children but here's the thing. Our lists, where did we get it from? It is through observations in the real world but that also is our bias. How do we know our kids will be brats if we never had kids in the first place?
Having children may definitely change a person unless you are like a kaydoo on the Maury show where kaydoo Don't care about his 10 kids by ten different baby Mamas. To some, they are building a Mimi me version of themselves as to the fails in their life, they wanted their children to accomplish it. It sounds like a lot but we can safely say that we will never know unless we are there.
I just hope people know what they are getting themselves into and will not let remorse or regret gets to them at the later golden ages.
I'm a good believing person and if a healthy normal person is able to have children like God's gift to men and I would say no thanks to God, I just can not see myself doing that.
I just worry more about the psychological consequences that comes with not having children by choice. I know that making the decision when being single is easier but when you are coupled up, it just gets harder.
If you want to test your husband, asked him if it is ok for you to get a vasectomy and see what he'll say. I'm concerning about him as well.
You see, in life, if you are not a mother or a father then what are you? You are then still a child and being a child needs more learning and training.
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Then why get marry? Your love is not strong enough thus why you are bonded by the married institution like is it suppose to lock the guy down from not straying.
It is like this. You can be vegan but don't make your vegetables to look like beef. You can be homo but don't be marrying each other and calling it a family of 2. You can be childless, sexless or whatever but don't get marry .
More reason why your Korean mother in law hate y'all Yom?
Stats do show that women handles this childless couple better than most men. So the concern is not all about you but to him as well. Perhaps he goes along just for your sake but I know one thing. I stayed childless to play the field. This article here talks about your husband.
Childfree men are viewed as immature playboys
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/complete-without-kids/201203/childfree-men-misunderstood-and-often-maligned?amp (https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/complete-without-kids/201203/childfree-men-misunderstood-and-often-maligned?amp)
Well this article talks about the psychological consequences for men who are childless.
https://www.psychreg.org/impact-male-involuntary-childlessness-part-1/ (https://www.psychreg.org/impact-male-involuntary-childlessness-part-1/)
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Then why get marry? Your love is not strong enough thus why you are bonded by the married institution like is it suppose to lock the guy down from not straying.
I married him because I love him, he's honest, and he's always there for me through bad and good. So explain to me all the married couple with kids that are out cheating behind their spouse's back? There's no guarantee when it comes to marriage that a person will remain faithful. Marriage doesn't lock anyone down, if person wants to cheat they will, if a person wants to leave they will regardless whether they're married with kids or not.
It is like this. You can be vegan but don't make your vegetables to look like beef. You can be homo but don't be marrying each other and calling it a family of 2. You can be childless, sexless or whatever but don't get marry .
I don't judge, if someone want to be Vegan for health reasons and to better the world, great for them. Turn beet into beef if they must. A family is what you make of it, whether it's just the two of you or ten. A family is someone that will always be there for each other regardless of how tough life gets, a family is someone I can count on. What do you consider family? A husband, wife, and kids? So here's an example:
My cousin who is married to this guy for over 10 years has two boys. Her husband was caught cheating with his secretary. She choose to stay with him, sleeping in separate bedrooms. They don't communicate. Is this a marriage? Is this a family? My husband and I have a healthy loving relationship, but because we have no kids, you don't consider this family? You're so judgmental and just because people don't conform to your way of thinking then it's the wrong way, therefore you put them down.
More reason why your Korean mother in law hate y'all Yom?
Wow! Didn't realize you're willing to stoop that low just because someone doesn't think the way you do. My mother in-law doesn't affect me in any way, she doesn't like anyone unless you're loaded with money, and you're either a doctor or lawyer, and Korean. She has no friends or family, her husband is out golfing all the time and they don't even talk. She wants to be filled with so much hatred, it's on her. She disowned her other son too because he's married to a Chinese woman. I can't go around pleasing everyone. I don't waste my days thinking about how I can make her happy and approve of me. Life is too short to surround myself with negative unpleasant people.
Stats do show that women handles this childless couple better than most men. So the concern is not all about you but to him as well. Perhaps he goes along just for your sake but I know one thing. I stayed childless to play the field. This article here talks about your husband.
Speaking as if you know my husband more then he know himself. My husband and I both don't want kids, I didn't convince him to not have kids. A real man is someone that will be there for me through bad and good, not whether he's a father. So this article also mentioned Brad Pitt with 6 kids. What happened to his marriage? Aren't they going through a custody battle right now? Oh wait...but they're married with kids, therefore that's a family and he's a real man.
Childfree men are viewed as immature playboys
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/complete-without-kids/201203/childfree-men-misunderstood-and-often-maligned?amp (https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/complete-without-kids/201203/childfree-men-misunderstood-and-often-maligned?amp)
Well this article talks about the psychological consequences for men who are childless.
https://www.psychreg.org/impact-male-involuntary-childlessness-part-1/ (https://www.psychreg.org/impact-male-involuntary-childlessness-part-1/)
Look at the case studies that you brought out. I don't care about other people's failure. That is your problem right there. You drawing the energy from other people's failed marriage to your own if you follow their footsteps. What about all the loving families out there that you failed to recognized as well.
Like I said before, results may varies and it is your own daymn fault in thinking that the world is jaded if you shall walk that lifestyle as well.
I already said that your choice is your choice but I'm also noted your bias in viewing this childless in marriage stance. If you really want to know how your cookies will crumble, just read on the testimonials of all the childless women who are in their late 50 because they have walked that line before. The line you are walking on isn't a new revolutionary concept at all. Psychological consequences is the key word to understand more.
Not my life but I'm just saying
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A real man is one who is not afraid to have children. You're an atheist that is married to Jesus Christ. :2funny:
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There is a science behind your decision of going childless. You atheist loves science right?
Well this thread alone already showed the amount of stress you are in and it comes with your way of life as other people will gawk at you and your husband or man child in going childless.
Around 4% of all couples remain involuntarily childless. These people often experience insufficient social support, which further aggravates the distress symptoms such as physical health problems, anxiety, depression and complicated grief.
https://academic.oup.com/humrep/article/22/1/288/2939130
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My thoughts to end the week is this.
We are not here to judge you. According to the atheist doctrine, there is no law that says thou shalt not judge.
We are here to throw out the facts and to show you what your science is saying. Now what you do from here on is up to you but I'd pray to the no God that I did not told you so.
You have the last word if you want. :2funny:
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It really is pointless to get married if you don't plan on having kids and raising a family.
You're not committing yourself to anything real.
You don't need a marriage to be with each other if it's just going to be the two of you. You can make arrangements for another type of social contract so as to not appear like you're just shacking up.
Marriage is about raising a family and uniting two families.
Again, why consolidate assets if you're not going to raise a family? That is actually really stupid unless of course you're marrying someone whose much richer than you are. O0 I get it. But if you're the one making more then you're really stupid.
All these distorted definitions of marriage is making the world wacky and producing generations of wacky children.
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You don't need marriage. You can get a power of attorney for each other and include the other in your will.
Whatever it is, stop distorting marriage for your own amusement, people!
Marriage is a real thing with real meaning. Don't get into it if you don't plan to uphold the real definition and intent.
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You don't need marriage. You can get a power of attorney for each other and include the other in your will.
Whatever it is, stop distorting marriage for your own amusement, people!
Marriage is a real thing with real meaning. Don't get into it if you don't plan to uphold the real definition and intent.
What do children do? They play make believe games like playing marriage and playing daddy mommy games without a child. The difference is that we probably played that games too but we left it there at the bottle feeding school.
Children I tell you. They can't even distinguish between who's who's are backing them up and what not, saying I'm judgmental but if I was, I would include how chosen such life path is a selfish act. Did I raise up such issue? Nah. People are going to gawk or giving them a stinky eye is a statement of fact. It is unnatural to their choices. It is like having a brain to think but decided not to think.
I'm done talking to her but Im just wanted to level it out to you and the rest of us that there is definitely something weird going on with today's weirdness.
Totally beyond traditional Hmong help. If I were judgemental, I would go as far as saying that she's marrying outsider does not void her of not being Hmong stance. :2funny:
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What do children do? They play make believe games like playing marriage and playing daddy mommy games without a child. The difference is that we probably played that games too but we left it there at the bottle feeding school.
LOL! We travel most of the time, exploring the world. Hiking or training at the gym when not traveling, We don't sit around at home all day playing mommy and daddy like you think.
Children I tell you. They can't even distinguish between who's who's are backing them up and what not, saying I'm judgmental but if I was, I would include how chosen such life path is a selfish act. Did I raise up such issue? Nah. People are going to gawk or giving them a stinky eye is a statement of fact. It is unnatural to their choices. It is like having a brain to think but decided not to think.
We back each other up. You talk about selfish act but yet you want to have children so they can take care of you when you're older and that you don't want to die alone. Anyone who doesn't conform to society is not natural to you, again, why do I care about what people think?
I'm done talking to her but Im just wanted to level it out to you and the rest of us that there is definitely something weird going on with today's weirdness.
You're done talking to me but keep coming back for more.
Totally beyond traditional Hmong help. If I were judgemental, I would go as far as saying that she's marrying outsider does not void her of not being Hmong stance. :2funny:
Wow, judgmental and narrow minded! And he claim to believe in GOD. I embrace my culture, have no shame in being HMONG. But the decision to be childless has nothing to do with my HMONG culture. It's a personal choice. I didn't realize having babies is a tradition? Again, some people who are eager to procreate shouldn't.
I did not quote you but believe in me. I was talking to her not you so stop acting like you and your childless crusade are entitled to something here.
I only replied to this one cuz obviously you are rude and need to calm the fawk down. Your unimportant life story is not important here
I did not say that your choice in life needs any acceptance from your Hmong traditional for approval. Hmong are known to have a big family but what the hell happened to you?
I don't bring up God's teaching when talking to you did I? If I did, how about the biblical verse to go forth and travel and don't have children, don't go forth and multiple and don't pass go.
So you travel but no matter where you travel, you will see more cultures that supports children, running around and playing but non for you.
Where the rest of the Hmong people at? Voice up your opinions America.
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You don't need marriage. You can get a power of attorney for each other and include the other in your will.
Whatever it is, stop distorting marriage for your own amusement, people!
Marriage is a real thing with real meaning. Don't get into it if you don't plan to uphold the real definition and intent.
I'm trying to find some positive into this whole mess. I can only think of one.
The Darwinism award.
Don't need to procreate to bring more people like herself into the next generation.
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Yeah, it is like a hot mess as there is a science that explains to why she is the way she is. Like eating at the buffet, pick any combination to complete your order.
Overall, the rising prevalence of childlessness is one aspect of the diversity of life-cycle experience among people of reproductive age. It arises from a combination of varied phenomena including: the decline of social pressures to marry and bear children, inability to find a partner, lack of interest in finding a partner, insufficient commitment in relationships, concern about the durability of relationships, concern about the prospects for children in insecure environments, financial problems and constraints, difficulties in combining parenting and employment, dislike of children, postponement of childbearing, declining fecundity at older ages of family formation, and pursuit of careers and material consumption.
Read more: Childlessness - Explanations - Family, Development, Marriage, and Women - JRank Articles http://family.jrank.org/pages/241/Childlessness-Explanations.html#ixzz5V3RmyMPR (http://family.jrank.org/pages/241/Childlessness-Explanations.html#ixzz5V3RmyMPR)
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Yep, they are heading for divorce. Typically Hmong
Being unmarried is one of the strongest predictors of childlessness. It has also been suggested through research that married individuals who were concerned about the stability of their marriages were more likely to remain childless.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voluntary_childlessness
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How can I join this group? Wtf right? :2funny:
The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement (VHEMT[A]) is an environmental movement that calls for all people to abstain from reproduction to cause the gradual voluntary extinction of humankind
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voluntary_Human_Extinction_Movement
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I found the word I'm looking for folks. It is called hedonism.
Hedonism is a school of thought that argues that the pursuit of pleasure and intrinsic goods are the primary or most important goals of human life.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonism (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonism)
Great mind like Plato is against you.
Anti-hedonists from Plato on have suggested that most people who devote themselves to pleasure-seeking are living a lie. Either they deny their own truest longing — in Plato's case, for eternity — or they deny how austere (and spiritually unfulfilling) a life devoted to pleasure really is. If someone truly feels no sign of dissatisfactio n at the prospect of pursuing one pleasure after another until both the desires and their satisfaction simply wink out of existence at the moment of death, then such a person might be a consistent hedonist, might really consider pleasure the highest good.
https://www.theweek.com/articles-amp/548430/selfdeception-intentionally-childless (https://www.theweek.com/articles-amp/548430/selfdeception-intentionally-childless)
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I don't see anything that say childless married couple will end up in divorce in this blog. You?
The 10 Most Common Reasons People get Divorced
1. Getting in for the wrong reasons.
Marrying for money -- we've all heard that that is a ticket to a quick divorce, but what about when you marry because it's what you think you should do?
I've met many divorced women who say the problems that made them leave were there right from the beginning but "everyone expected us to live happily ever after" or "we had already spent so much money on the wedding" or "we had just built our dream home." So, remember, until you say "I do," you always have the choice to say "I don't!"
2. Lack of individual identity.
A codependent relationship is not healthy. When you don't have your own interests or the opportunity to express yourself outside of coupledom, you become "couple dumb."
If you are not comfortable doing things without your partner, or you don't know what kind of music, movies, or food you used to like, you are likely in deep and you probably feel like you are drowning and don't know why.
3. Becoming lost in the roles.
Just as many couples "forget" their single friends and single ways when they get married, when you add children into the mix, most parents soon neglect or completely forget that they are a couple.
As children grow and need less attention, many husbands and wives find that they have grown apart and they can't remember why they ever got married in the first place because they no longer have anything in common.
4. Not having a shared vision of success.
"Everything changed when we got married!" He drives you crazy because you're a saver and he's a spender. Your idea of a weekend getaway is a cozy cottage in the woods; your partner wants to the hit the town and catch a game. He thinks it's your job to cook and clean, but you disagree.
Why didn't he mention these things before? Maybe you should have asked. Chances are that he hasn't changed -- your expectations did. Is it possible to survive major differences in philosophy? It is possible, but many do not.
5. The intimacy disappears.
Somewhere in a marriage there is a subtle change in the intimacy department. One person has an off day, there is a misunderstandi ng or someone doesn't feel well. Then there's the idea that he isn't as romantic or she isn't as sexual.
Whoever is the one with the subtle change can trigger a downward spiral in the intimacy department. Men generally need sexual receptivity to feel romantic and women generally need romance to be sexual receptive. As long as both people are getting what they need, they willingly provide what the other person wants. However, when there is a lessening on either's part, that can trigger a pulling back in the other. If gone unnoticed and unchecked, before the couple realizes, they are seriously intimately estranged and wonder what happened. This can lead to divorce as couples begin to feel unloved and unappreciated.
6. Unmet expectations.
Somewhere written into a human's genetic code lie the instruction that when a person isn't happy, he or she is supposed to force his/her significant to make the changes required to make the unhappy person happy again. This usually takes the form of complaining, blaming, criticizing, nagging, threatening, punishing and/or bribing.
When one or both people in the marriage are attempting to coerce each other into doing things they don't want to do for their partner's happiness, it is a recipe for disaster. When you are unhappy in a relationship, it's okay to ask for the change you want. But, if your partner doesn't oblige you, then you become responsible for your own happiness.
7. Finances.
It's not usually the lack of finances that causes the divorce, but the lack of compatibility in the financial arena.
Opposites can attract but when two people are opposites in the financial department, divorce often ensues. Imagine the conflict if one is a saver and one is a spender. One is focused on the future while the other believes in living for today. One has no problem buying on credit, while the other believes in saving up for what one wants.
Over time, this conflict can reach such heights that divorce seems to be the only logical conclusion.
8. Being out of touch... literally.
I'm talking about physical contact. Of course, sex is great, but you also need to supplement it with little hello and goodbye kisses, impromptu hugs and simply holding hands. Couples who don't maintain an intimate connection through both sexual and non-sexual actions are destined to become virtual strangers.
9. Different priorities and interests.
Having shared interests and exploring them together is essential for a successful marriage. Of course, having "me time" is important as well, but unless you can find common passions and look for ways to experience them together, you'll inevitably grow farther and farther apart.
10. Inability to resolve conflicts.
Every couple has disagreements. The key is to develop ground rules so that each partner feels respected and heard. Sometimes it takes a third party "referee" to help define those rules and teach us to move through the charged emotions so resentments don't linger.
Here goes your 66%. That's you. :2funny:
Divorce rate childless couples
If you have a childless marriage. The absence of children leads to loneliness, and at least 66 percent of divorced couples in the United States are childless.
Yes, according to journalist Anneli Rufus, whose number crunching discovered that of the divorced couples in the United States, 66 percent are childless compared with 40 percent who have kids. Why? Evidently, the "absence of children leads to loneliness and weariness
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/are-childfree-couples-doo_b_913051/amp (https://www.huffpost.com/entry/are-childfree-couples-doo_b_913051/amp)
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Oh my Gawd!!!! 3 page of nonsense...... .your life, your choice. Whether 20 kids or zero kids, whatever makes you/couples happy.
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Oh my Gawd!!!! 3 page of nonsense...... .your life, your choice. Whether 20 kids or zero kids, whatever makes you/couples happy.
Yeah but some people do not accept the public announcement that I gave with facts.
I'm getting tired. I need to go visit other people's thread too.
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Did you not take Philosophy course in college? Glad you learned something new today.
Glad to be a part of your life. Don't forget about me when you do have children.
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that was fast....the MIB came knocking on my door fast....the Aliens advise me to removed what I wrote fast...haha
Until then, the battle was lost, but the war continues..... for now, just ride along folks....I still remember my promise to the world...no worries...haha
Just letting you know that I have read it. Your secret is good with me. :2funny:
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You don't need marriage. You can get a power of attorney for each other and include the other in your will.
Whatever it is, stop distorting marriage for your own amusement, people!
Marriage is a real thing with real meaning. Don't get into it if you don't plan to uphold the real definition and intent.
I do agree with this. People don’t need to get married if they prefer not to have kids.....but people do because of the advantages that marriage brings.
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There are plenty of articles online just about everything and anything. I'm not that gullible to believe everything that is ever written.
Not everyone think the way you do, it's their body, their life, their choice. So enough with the judging. No matter what you do, people will talk shit. So just live the way you want to live and be true to yourself even if the world is against you. That's true happiness!
I'm glad you acknowledged the fact that people will talk chit about you hence when I said that people will gawk at you, I knew I was up to something.
Like I said before, you do what is best for you but always know what you are getting yourself into. The road less travelled, many people may not see but only say so and so out of concern.
Through my limited research, I was able to see the many classification that labels you and the tolerance if society that speaks upon it.
Just like being gay. If it is by choice then that's a no no but if biological like infertility then that is more understandable .
I will share with you this. During my mid life crisis stages if my life, I looked at other people's kids and go awe. It was short lived and a phase in my life. You will get yours and it will be more overwhelming because by nature, a female carries the womb so at a certain age, you will hear this motherly instinct kicking on in.
That's all I need to say and for you to be aware of it. I have read other people's testimonial who were like you, by choice but are their late 50's, the age of no return and we'll.... I'm not going to feed you anymore to what I know.
Bless be with you and good luck, we are done here.
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Tell us why again are we digging into other cases of failed marriages or regret mom when they are not on trial here? Even if you do go there, what their failure has to do with you and your childlessness phobia?
We are talking about your case and since you brought up Facebook, here goes a childless mother group therapy blog for you. :2funny:
https://m.facebook.com/thechildlessmother/
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Judgmental. Narrow Minded. Uneducated. You think like a child and yet you feel strongly about procreating :idiot2:.
Thanks for entertaining me the past few days while I'm getting over my cold. Just remember, It's not little DUMASS responsibility to take care of you, be there for you when you're feeling lonely, to make you feel loved, and to be by your bedside because you're too afraid to die alone, or prevent people from gawking at you.
Thank you and don't forget.... Without children, it'll just be you and your Korean husband in this world. Divorcee isn't something new with the Hmong either. Korean is not exempt from a growing epidemic with their own divorce rate either.
Divorce ― once seen as a taboo subject ― is becoming more common around the world, including Korea, as couples choose it over an unhappy marriage.
https://m.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia/article/2059241/spiking-divorce-rate-changes-korean-laws-and-marriages
Once again. Good luck but never good riddance. :2funny: