PebHmong Discussion Forum
General Category => Hmong Culture & History => Wedding Rituals & Customs => Topic started by: silence on December 08, 2011, 09:09:00 PM
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If you could change a thing or two about today's traditional Hmong weddings, what would it be?
Mine would be no more dowry fee. No money in this world could pay for the hard labor, headaches, worries, etc that a mother goes through to raise her daughter to be come a nyab. I would rather use that money to make her wedding a memoriable one and/or give it to her to start her marriage with.
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i think you meant the "milk/food" fee...or "nqi mig nqi no".....however, the correct term would be "cow" fee. the "dowry" fee would be "khoom phij cuam," particularly "lub ncauj tsiag"...aka "nyuj phij tsab neeg phij cuam" given from the bride's parents to the groom. in weddings, we don't refer to the fee as anything other than "cow." the reason is...in china, no money was used, instead, cows were used, this is why we dont' say "money," instead, we say "cow" (cow/oxens/chickens are very sacred animals--and valuable--to the mong).
in essence, i do not think you are fully awared of how the these "fees" play the lives of the groom/bride. it is ok to get rid of it...but keep in mind that a wedding also involves a funeral. wedding also unites two clans through the bonding of gift exchange. if no cows were exchanged, "qab hluas niam txiv tsi tuav lawm.." meaning that the "relationship" will not be there anymore....whi ch also leads to "no promises" of unity between two clans..which also leads to "no niam txiv dab, no cuag, no xov txiv dab etc.." during the bride/groom's death....which MEANS, AT THE FUNERAL OF BRIDE/GROOM, NO ONE WILL BE THERE TO HELP OUT...only the bride/groom and maybe cuab tsav....
in actuality, the groom doesn't loose anything DURING A MONG WEDDING ...and here is why....during a mong wedding, the items exchanged are:
1. a cow (bride fee...given from groom fee to bride's parents) for the bride...but in return, the groom gets another cow (ncauj tsiag) and the bride
2. arrows are exchanged (we dont' practice this anymore)...this arrow is the same arrow used to summon "niam txiv dab" upon death of bride/groom
3. diav, ntsev, tsoj, cawv...chicken s...
4. MOST IMPORTANTLY... .A DAUGHTER IS PROMISED TO THE TXIV DAB (HIS SON) ONCE THE BRIDE/GROOM HAD THEIR KIDS....TO FURTHER STRENGTHEN THEir UNITY...IN OTHER WORD...A PROMISE TO EXCHANGE FURTHER DAUGTHERS...
in my opinion....we should not get rid of the bride price...instea d we should lower it....there has to be a bride price for both weddings and funerals to exist...so if we can't pay a cow...why not pay a chicken (less money). this is the only way to keep the tradition alive.
on the other issue regarding the groom not able to pay for a bride price...any groom who is not able to pay for bride price should not get married....it will only cause headaches for themselves and for their parents. they will end up getting a divorce which will destroy the relationship between the two clans because of the groom's unmanly life. any man should be able to pay 10k for a wife (the wife is worth billions people...she is the source of life for you and your future....! i'm sure if you are man enough, you could come up with 10k!!!!!!!!!!!). i fyou can't pay for your wife, then don't get married....and any bride who marries a LOOOOOOOOOOSER who can't pay fo rhis wife is also a LOOOOOOOOOOOSE R......SO GET THIS THROUGH YORU HEAD PEOPLE....neve r mind the love, the affection...ne ver mind your feelings..."KUV HLUB HLUB NWG LI, KU VYAUV YUAV NWS XWB, tsi muaj nyiaj los its ok" :idiot2:....this is your life people...not your fantasies....
advice for women: if your bf can't pay for you, dont' marry him...he will be a looser all his life...it could be that he is young and has no money yet...BUT HELLO...IT IS PEOPLE LIKE THIS WHO AR EMAKING STUPID DECISIONS ALL THE TIME...AND AT THE WRONG TIME...WITH FANTASY LALALAND THOUGHTS....a woman should outgrow her "blind love" by accepting that any man who can't pay for her is a looser and/or has no respect at all for traditions...O R HIS IS A LOST SOUL WITH NO SENSE OF RESPONSIBLITY. ...DITCH HIM LADIES....HE WILL BE A BAD PROVIDER FOR YOU, you will suffer because he would only rely on others to help out....YOU WILL HAVE HEADACHES THROUGHOUT YOUR LIFE if you marry such a man.
advice for men: know yourself, know your responsibility ...if you canpt pay ....PLEASE WORK YOUR ASS OFF AND GET THE MONEY TO PAY FOR YOUR WIFE BEFORE YORU WEDDING (remember...you r wilfe is worth billions...and you only have to pay 10k...ITS THE BEST DEAL OF YOUR LIFETIME!!!!).......if you can't pay, hold off the marriage....DO NT' RELY ON YOUR PARENTS...THEY ARE OLD AND FEEBLE...YOU ARE YOUR OWN MAN, TO YOURSELF, YOUR WIFE, AND YOUR PARENTS...BE RESPONSIBLE AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR OWN RESPONSIBILITY AS A MAN.
yaweh
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I have sons of my own. I will explain the importance of drinking with your brother-in-laws until you passed out like your old man and is carried to the car- to my sons. Yawm yij yawm dab nco ntsoov tej kev sib zeem sib hlub sib khis ua neej ua tsav.
Marrying in a church? " With this ring I take thee to be my wife." Who the f*ck are you people kidding?
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F*king dumbaxx... Hmong people do not charge "dowry fee" stupid... Gosh I hope you are not planning on getting hitch any time soon. :D You cannot afford the money for a wedding then why do you want to get marry for?
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as harsh as qau said...it is true...."i take you to be my...through bad/worst...etc..." is nothing but a charade. mong, however, does practice that even though they do not say it...think about it...
but of course, in the usa, one little hardship and people grow wings....hahah aahahahaa....
yaweh
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Today, anything goes.
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Anything goes these days.
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Nowadays, anything goes.
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Almost yog 2012 lawm, anything goes.
O0 O0 O0 :2funny: :2funny:
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Despicable youths and ignorant people in here. Jeezzzzzzzz... ..... :police:
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I’ve heard that with SOME families, they feel when they’ve paid a bride price…… if they don’t like her, they tend to boss the daughter-n-law around and treat her like a servant at times. Do you know of anyone in such a situation?
Also, I heard someone say…..it’s sort like an investment. When people have to put money towards something, they’re likely to value it more than if they hadn’t invested anything in it. Do you think that’s somewhat true???
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^did you hit a midday epiphany there? ???
how was the Lao family rally BTW? oh, that's right. you didn't go, m(r)s Lao family hater cheap talker.
(((Loads Cum))) -- what was it that you want?
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I have no problem with the groom paying the price because in my family, my parents actually didnt profit money. My dad always want to eat cow cuz he was very poor when he was young, so he say he'll not kill pig but cow only for his daughters (theres 4 of us girls). When my two older sisters and I got married he killed one cow for each of us, plus our dowry/gifts&money total more than our price. So it was a win win for both side. and plus the money&gifts are for the couple to start their life. I wouldnt change a thing with our hmong tradition wedding, its unique and different. if anyone want to do an american wedding, they can do it afterwards, its not like anyone is stopping them.
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I have no problem with the groom paying the price because in my family, my parents actually didnt profit money. My dad always want to eat cow cuz he was very poor when he was young, so he say he'll not kill pig but cow only for his daughters (theres 4 of us girls). When my two older sisters and I got married he killed one cow for each of us, plus our dowry/gifts&money total more than our price. So it was a win win for both side. and plus the money&gifts are for the couple to start their life. I wouldnt change a thing with our hmong tradition wedding, its unique and different. if anyone want to do an american wedding, they can do it afterwards, its not like anyone is stopping them.
Pls STOP USING the word or phrase "PRICE" - you making yourself equal to the animal you killed.
AnyWho, if you love tradition like you MENTIONED - Killing a COW for UR wedding is OUT of Tradition. Never - ever - ever kill a cow in lieu of the pig. You call have cattle meat but don't kill the cow as you stated to replace the pig. Your life will be miserable in your marriage. Ask the elders...
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If you could change a thing or two about today's traditional Hmong weddings, what would it be?
Mine would be no more dowry fee. No money in this world could pay for the hard labor, headaches, worries, etc that a mother goes through to raise her daughter to be come a nyab. I would rather use that money to make her wedding a memoriable one and/or give it to her to start her marriage with.
While there are probably some parents trying to cash in on their daughter, everybody knows that the practice was instilled so that the groom's clan fully understands the value of the bride to her own clan. Whether the bride's parent are asking for $1 or $10k, she is not going to be free.
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I have sons of my own. I will explain the importance of drinking with your brother-in-laws until you passed out like your old man and is carried to the car- to my sons. Yawm yij yawm dab nco ntsoov tej kev sib zeem sib hlub sib khis ua neej ua tsav.
Marrying in a church? " With this ring I take thee to be my wife." Who the f*ck are you people kidding?
This only works for mekas because it aligns with their mentality which is deeply-rooted in their religious beliefs. Hmong practicing this is pretty absurd.
When Hmong start to observe other people's customs, they should at least be very educated about why they do what they do.
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2. arrows are exchanged (we dont' practice this anymore)...this arrow is the same arrow used to summon "niam txiv dab" upon death of bride/groom
I've only seen the arrow used once. My dad had a sister cousin that came to America that died without him knowing. During the funeral her husband and his relative didn't call on my dad and our relatives. One of the funeral goers tells them that they had asked the wrong Yang guy to come represent the deceased. Once they get the story straight, the husband's relatives came to our house with the arrow for my dad. My dad, who didn't know that his sister cousin had died or that she was even here in America made it very hard for those guys. He wouldn't take the arrow, and those guys had to kneel for a long time.
In the end, my dad had found out that his sister cousin had came to America for about a year, her husband treated her like shit, didn't let her contact or go find her relatives, and died in a car accident when the husband was teaching her at night how to drive.
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If you could change a thing or two about today's traditional Hmong weddings, what would it be?
Mine would be no more dowry fee. No money in this world could pay for the hard labor, headaches, worries, etc that a mother goes through to raise her daughter to be come a nyab. I would rather use that money to make her wedding a memoriable one and/or give it to her to start her marriage with.
You mean the bride price? The bride price is a gesture for parents to show the groom's family how much they value their own daughter. We already know that you can't technically put a price on a person but think of it like the American courts where you're asked to produce something measurable to prove your case. Can you really prove how much someone loves you or not? Technically, no. But the court may ask you to and thus, you must scrounge up gift receipts, cards, pictures, love notes, etc. This is the same intention with the Hmong bride price.
Please do not knock down something because you have adopted a western mentality. Their way is only right for them.
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i think you meant the "milk/food" fee...or "nqi mig nqi no".....however, the correct term would be "cow" fee. the "dowry" fee would be "khoom phij cuam," particularly "lub ncauj tsiag"...aka "nyuj phij tsab neeg phij cuam" given from the bride's parents to the groom. in weddings, we don't refer to the fee as anything other than "cow." the reason is...in china, no money was used, instead, cows were used, this is why we dont' say "money," instead, we say "cow" (cow/oxens/chickens are very sacred animals--and valuable--to the mong).
in essence, i do not think you are fully awared of how the these "fees" play the lives of the groom/bride. it is ok to get rid of it...but keep in mind that a wedding also involves a funeral. wedding also unites two clans through the bonding of gift exchange. if no cows were exchanged, "qab hluas niam txiv tsi tuav lawm.." meaning that the "relationship" will not be there anymore....whi ch also leads to "no promises" of unity between two clans..which also leads to "no niam txiv dab, no cuag, no xov txiv dab etc.." during the bride/groom's death....which MEANS, AT THE FUNERAL OF BRIDE/GROOM, NO ONE WILL BE THERE TO HELP OUT...only the bride/groom and maybe cuab tsav....
in actuality, the groom doesn't loose anything DURING A MONG WEDDING ...and here is why....during a mong wedding, the items exchanged are:
1. a cow (bride fee...given from groom fee to bride's parents) for the bride...but in return, the groom gets another cow (ncauj tsiag) and the bride
2. arrows are exchanged (we dont' practice this anymore)...this arrow is the same arrow used to summon "niam txiv dab" upon death of bride/groom
3. diav, ntsev, tsoj, cawv...chicken s...
4. MOST IMPORTANTLY... .A DAUGHTER IS PROMISED TO THE TXIV DAB (HIS SON) ONCE THE BRIDE/GROOM HAD THEIR KIDS....TO FURTHER STRENGTHEN THEir UNITY...IN OTHER WORD...A PROMISE TO EXCHANGE FURTHER DAUGTHERS...
in my opinion....we should not get rid of the bride price...instea d we should lower it....there has to be a bride price for both weddings and funerals to exist...so if we can't pay a cow...why not pay a chicken (less money). this is the only way to keep the tradition alive.
on the other issue regarding the groom not able to pay for a bride price...any groom who is not able to pay for bride price should not get married....it will only cause headaches for themselves and for their parents. they will end up getting a divorce which will destroy the relationship between the two clans because of the groom's unmanly life. any man should be able to pay 10k for a wife (the wife is worth billions people...she is the source of life for you and your future....! i'm sure if you are man enough, you could come up with 10k!!!!!!!!!!!). i fyou can't pay for your wife, then don't get married....and any bride who marries a LOOOOOOOOOOSER who can't pay fo rhis wife is also a LOOOOOOOOOOOSE R......SO GET THIS THROUGH YORU HEAD PEOPLE....neve r mind the love, the affection...ne ver mind your feelings..."KUV HLUB HLUB NWG LI, KU VYAUV YUAV NWS XWB, tsi muaj nyiaj los its ok" :idiot2:....this is your life people...not your fantasies....
advice for women: if your bf can't pay for you, dont' marry him...he will be a looser all his life...it could be that he is young and has no money yet...BUT HELLO...IT IS PEOPLE LIKE THIS WHO AR EMAKING STUPID DECISIONS ALL THE TIME...AND AT THE WRONG TIME...WITH FANTASY LALALAND THOUGHTS....a woman should outgrow her "blind love" by accepting that any man who can't pay for her is a looser and/or has no respect at all for traditions...O R HIS IS A LOST SOUL WITH NO SENSE OF RESPONSIBLITY. ...DITCH HIM LADIES....HE WILL BE A BAD PROVIDER FOR YOU, you will suffer because he would only rely on others to help out....YOU WILL HAVE HEADACHES THROUGHOUT YOUR LIFE if you marry such a man.
advice for men: know yourself, know your responsibility ...if you canpt pay ....PLEASE WORK YOUR ASS OFF AND GET THE MONEY TO PAY FOR YOUR WIFE BEFORE YORU WEDDING (remember...you r wilfe is worth billions...and you only have to pay 10k...ITS THE BEST DEAL OF YOUR LIFETIME!!!!).......if you can't pay, hold off the marriage....DO NT' RELY ON YOUR PARENTS...THEY ARE OLD AND FEEBLE...YOU ARE YOUR OWN MAN, TO YOURSELF, YOUR WIFE, AND YOUR PARENTS...BE RESPONSIBLE AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR OWN RESPONSIBILITY AS A MAN.
yaweh
npawg now and days anything goes.. An example just because i didn't pay the 10k doesn't mean i'm a loser..i just think it's ridiculous.. money i can make another day another dollar, but the person who i'm married to and i spent 10k for? better have something up front to offer too..we live in this country today is not like back in our families home land..it's not "ib hnub haus peb dias dej kub tsuav wb sib hlub xwb ces zoo lawm" es yuav carry farmer tools to luaj teb half a side of the mountain. :o as you please... today's world, better get your butt up at 6 am and help or we have no roof over our head because bills will never let you slide and no food on the table.
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A fair brideprice for a groom to pay should be just a little out of his reach. Make it too comfortable then he will boast. Make it too impossible then he will resent. Just a little out of his reach so that he'll remember the sacrifice he made for his bride.
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If you could change a thing or two about today's traditional Hmong weddings, what would it be?
Mine would be no more dowry fee. No money in this world could pay for the hard labor, headaches, worries, etc that a mother goes through to raise her daughter to be come a nyab. I would rather use that money to make her wedding a memoriable one and/or give it to her to start her marriage with.
I didn't pay one...
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I didn't pay one...
Sadly but true, it only applied to a Hmong male. Any other race is free of charge.
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A fair brideprice for a groom to pay should be just a little out of his reach. Make it too comfortable then he will boast. Make it too impossible then he will resent. Just a little out of his reach so that he'll remember the sacrifice he made for his bride.
but at the end she wasn't a guaranteed.. >:( ;D
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For those who's complaining about the token fee. Just letting you know...I am available and free. I'm not kidding and I will be sure you are both very happy in bed and out in public. Thanks.