PebHmong Discussion Forum
News & Announcements => News Headlines => Hmong News => Topic started by: fOrEvEr_sUn_76 on April 01, 2015, 10:14:29 AM
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This is the story of a Hmong dude who still practice the way of the Hmong traditional Kidnapped for Marriage process. According to the news article, 21-year-old Kong Meng Xiong of Shoreview recently kidnapped his 15-year-old girlfriend of 3 months from her home and force her to submit to a Hmong marriage. Later, the girl's parents contacted Xiong's parents about the kidnapping and Xiong's parents said they wanted Xiong and the girl to be married in the Hmong cultural way. The girl's parents respond by saying that tradition doesn't work here in the USA and that what they did was wrong. During an interview after her release from captivity, the girl told police she and Xiong first started their relationship in January 2015 and that they had sex before the girl's 15th birthday (which I assume occur somewhere between then and April Fool), Xiong in the interview admit to every actions he did and agree that what he did was wrong.
Xiong has been charged with kidnapping, third-degree criminal sexual conduct and false imprisonment. If convicted, he could be sentenced to 20 years in prison and $35,000 in fines on the kidnapping charge; up to 15 years in prison and $30,000 in fines on the sexual conduct charge; and up to three years in prison and $5,000 in fines on the false imprisonment charge.
Read the full article here...
http://kstp.com/news/stories/s3752364.shtml?cat=1 (http://kstp.com/news/stories/s3752364.shtml?cat=1)
So what do you guys think, do you think Xiong's don't know better or do you think he deserve to be charge? His intend wasn't kidnapping for ransom, sex or anything, just for marriage. I assume his family are still holding onto tradition or something. Anyways tell me what you think about this article.
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this unai state ahmayleeka e not da lao or da thai lang.
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this unai state ahmayleeka e not da lao or da thai lang.
My thoughts exactly. I'm so sick of hearing Hmong people say "this is america" like they're model American citizens above others and that kidnapping and statutory rape doesn't already happen in this country. This guy's morals are socially frowned upon, but at least he was willing to take responsibility the way he knew. I don't condone his actions, and thankfully the parents did the right thing because I'm sure this marriage would eventually crash due to the cultural differences, but some of these "Hmong Americans" got to stop acting like a snob.
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Let him be an example to all other who think its ok to go snatch little girl for their own need.
I'm sure most of you would call the cop if your daughter was underage, taken and the other family insisted that they get marry and refuse to return her. This is America. Even back in Laos and Thailand this was wrong, but people worry to much about face over their own daughter and they allowed it to happen. It wont work here. we don't need children having children.
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Dang, he's done this before?? Wow .. !! Lock him up and throw away the keys.
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I blame the girls parents, who let her go out with a 21 yr old guy in the first place. If she was my daughter I would have grounded her from day one for talking to him. Why do people shift all the blame to the guy? She was willing to spread her legs for him. All a sudden she is innocent because of age, that is BS. I know that when I was that age us girls did worse things out of curiosity and being a rebel to see how far things would go.
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Just gotta say, thank goodness, I don't have a girl to worry about. On the other hand, the guy is a moron. Hope he goes to jail. Both parents are stupid, please don't have anymore kids.
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For God's sake, why do ppl use the this is America and we're all americans now. This is 2015, stuff like this is for FOBs, we should be modern. They think they're self-righteous because they're more modern than you and me because they live in the U.S.?
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This is America, and I'm sure glad it is!!! Otherwise, this girl would've been forced to marry him as I've seen on several occasions in Laos and Thailand when I lived there and no punishment given to the caveman and other cavemen that helped him with his crime. Again, this is America...alth ough not perfect due to cavemen like behaviors occurring from time to time, at least the cavemen will received some form of punishments for their primitive acts unlike in other countries such as Laos, and when I say "cavemen", I mean all groups of Americans that exhibit those primitive behaviors not just Hmong-American. Sadly, some primitive cavemen and women too will never learn so I agree with the poster that said, "lock him up and throw away the keys"...
If that minor girl was my daughter and was taken by force by this caveman, he would have to deal with a beat down or a bullet in the head...Those type of primitive forced marriage practices gotta go regardless of location or country.
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guilty and he's fawked!!
"Kiong previously pleaded guilty to first-degree criminal sexual conduct in May 2009 for an incident involving a 13-year-old girl."
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guilty and he's fawked!!
"Kiong previously pleaded guilty to first-degree criminal sexual conduct in May 2009 for an incident involving a 13-year-old girl."
Sadly, some primitive cavemen and women too will never learn so I agree with the poster that said, "lock him up and throw away the keys"...
...regardless if it's bride-nap, pedophilia, stututory rape, domestic abuse, animal cruelty, forced alcohol poisoned of minor, etc....
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Sadly, some primitive cavemen and women too will never learn so I agree with the poster that said, "lock him up and throw away the keys"...
...regardless if it's bride-nap, pedophilia, stututory rape, domestic abuse, animal cruelty, forced alcohol poisoned of minor, etc....
Stories like these tend to make the hmong people looked bad. So unfair
Like when I was dating a hmong chick, my sport bookie is Laotian and so when he heard that, he said in broken english. "you marry hmong, you buy" I'm like WTF?
I'm glad I am so over hmong kids. Like if they are barely over 18, if you take them home after midnight or you take their virginity, you are going to marry them. These days, I'm upping my standards and only date them hmong women who parents are a tad Americanize. Safe haven for me. :2funny:
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Stories like these tend to make the hmong people looked bad. So unfair
Yep, agree. Hopefully with more and more Hmong are progressing in the right direction, that label will diminish...
Like most of other race and/or ethnic groups, most Hmong are good but still a good number doing things the primitive ways...there are bad apples in every group.
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She gave him all the chances in the world but he was n no good, so she dumps him. She tried sex with him to see if he was great in bed but he was not, what did he expect he should just move on. That's the most a girl can offer a guy to impressed her.
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I bet this 21 year old lives in the basement of his mom and dads and plays video games..kids should be treated like kids...the kids parents should of returned the other kid....fawkin grow up and get the fawk out of your parents house and stop playin video games...before you bring home a wife..
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Guess he mus be Fresh off the Boat! We all know that shit don't work in AhMerca.
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Kiong is Hmong?
This is the story of a Hmong dude who still practice the way of the Hmong traditional Kidnapped for Marriage process. According to the news article, 21-year-old Kong Meng Kiong of Shoreview recently kidnapped his 15-year-old girlfriend of 3 months from her home and force her to submit to a Hmong marriage. Later, the girl's parents contacted Kiong's parents about the kidnapping and Kiong's parents said they wanted Kiong and the girl to be married in the Hmong cultural way. The girl's parents respond by saying that tradition doesn't work here in the USA and that what they did was wrong. During an interview after her release from captivity, the girl told police she and Kiong first started their relationship in January 2015 and that they had sex before the girl's 15th birthday (which I assume occur somewhere between then and April Fool), Kiong in the interview admit to every actions he did and agree that what he did was wrong.
Kiong has been charged with kidnapping, third-degree criminal sexual conduct and false imprisonment. If convicted, he could be sentenced to 20 years in prison and $35,000 in fines on the kidnapping charge; up to 15 years in prison and $30,000 in fines on the sexual conduct charge; and up to three years in prison and $5,000 in fines on the false imprisonment charge.
Read the full article here...
http://kstp.com/news/stories/s3752364.shtml?cat=1 (http://kstp.com/news/stories/s3752364.shtml?cat=1)
So what do you guys think, do you think Kiong's don't know better or do you think he deserve to be charge? His intend wasn't kidnapping for ransom, sex or anything, just for marriage. I assume his family are still holding onto tradition or something. Anyways tell me what you think about this article.
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i was thinking the same too... he must be from those new hybrid clans... you know, like a cross between a hmoob kwm or khab and a xyooj... that or the media just butchered his xiong last name... lol!
Media butchered it. The author apparently doesn't know the correct spelling or read it wrong. FAIL.
K does not equal X.
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The most honorable way to marry a bride is to go and ask the parents for her hands. Lay off the kidnapping and teenaged sex, no matter how fob or traditional one person is. I guess some folks still have not recognized that Hmong tradition does not supercede the law of the land.
I still can't figure out if I should sympathize with the young man and his plight.
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i was thinking the same too... he must be from those new hybrid clans... you know, like a cross between a hmoob kwm or khab and a xyooj... that or the media just butchered his xiong last name... lol!
Yeap, he's a Xiong, that original article screwed up the clan name. Here's a better article of the same story.
http://www.twincities.com/crime/ci_27823556/shoreview-man-kidnapped-sexually-assaulted-girl-15-force (http://www.twincities.com/crime/ci_27823556/shoreview-man-kidnapped-sexually-assaulted-girl-15-force)
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According to the article, her parents didn't find out what happened to her until after midnight? ??? I'm sorry but if I had an underage daughter, I would know where she is that late of the night......in bed or at home. All parties are at fault here, but to different extents. No one is blameless in this incident. ::)
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According to the article, her parents didn't find out what happened to her until after midnight? ??? I'm sorry but if I had an underage daughter, I would know where she is that late of the night......in bed or at home. All parties are at fault here, but to different extents. No one is blameless in this incident. ::)
Is it possible that they were searching for her during the time they've considered she's missing and didn't know "until after midnight"? ???
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Tej teeb meem zoo li nos happens every day and to all kind of people, tsi yog Hmong xwb. So txhob cem cem parents thiab. Hmoob muaj ib proverbs tias "yog tsi tau ua parents txhob maj tuag" One day our being parent term will come and see how good some of us are.
Parents yeej paub thiab educated their children as much as they could. Tab si menyuam tsi tau paub tab, lawv xav ua lis lawv xav xwb ce dhaus me ntsi lawm. Dhau li tej zaum, qhov niag new system thiab society zoo dhaus qhov zoo lawm ce tib neeg phav tsi tau li.
God bless!
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Is it possible that they were searching for her during the time they've considered she's missing and didn't know "until after midnight"? ???
I'm not sure. The article states that the brother told them where she was and the brothers knew where he lived, so the parents were able to go to his house and bring her back home.
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Bride price issue. She eloped and her parents are disadvantaged in the negotiations. The way to handle this is to show who's boss over her and her guy's family.
I bet you 100% that these two families know one another well and know what could and would happen if they were to let her elope successfully or to have the groom come and beg for her hands at her parents'.
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Very civilized n smarty American kids ... What a smart way to use the Hmong broken system to shield ur own phedophile acts... I guess u will soon find out how uncivilized Hmong broken system is now :knuppel2:
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... kekeke ... ;D
This has NOTHING to do with Hmong marriage customs period; bride-napping or otherwise for underage girls as that was already discouraged and even disallowed in SEAsia (Laos/Thailand) during the late 20th Century by the overwhelming majority of Hmong, and is clearly prohibited in the USA once the Hmong become conscious/knowledgeable of US laws.
Whomever (HA'MUNG) professes that this case is Hmong tradition whatsoever related is just purely out of touch with reality ... :idiot2:
The guy and girl obviously had a clue what they were doing. And getting busted/caught just made matters worst on both front (with the minor getting off free while the elder will be bait for his cellmaties) ... KEKEKE ... >:D
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... kekeke ... ;D
This has NOTHING to do with Hmong marriage customs period; bride-napping or otherwise for underage girls as that was already discouraged and even disallowed in SEAsia (Laos/Thailand) during the late 20th Century by the overwhelming majority of Hmong, and is clearly prohibited in the USA once the Hmong become conscious/knowledgeable of US laws.
Whomever (HA'MUNG) professes that this case is Hmong tradition whatsoever related is just purely out of touch with reality ... :idiot2:
The guy and girl obviously had a clue what they were doing. And getting busted/caught just made matters worst on both front (with the minor getting off free while the elder will be bait for his cellmaties) ... KEKEKE ... >:D
Exactly, so sick of hearing Hmong people proclaim this is tradition. It's about as much a part of Hmong tradition as killing, raping, and extorting natives is tradition to the French, British, and Spanish. Everyone knows it's a no-no, yet people still do what they think they can get away with because in third world and underdeveloped countries there is no law that will stop them.
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This has NOTHING to do with Hmong marriage customs period;
Then why are weddings still happening when the bride is kidnapped or "zij"? Why didn't they (the groom and bride's parents) deny the wedding proceedings since it has "NOTHING to do with Hmong marriage customs period"?
Fact is, bride kidnapping is one way to get married and it is a part of the Hmong marriage customs. And it's been part of it for centuries. Even happens today as we can see on this thread. Good thing the girl's parents had enough sense not to go through with it.
You can deny all you want that bride kidnapping is not part of the traditional Hmong wedding process but the research will deny your claim. Besides the elders' words and others that have actually witnessed this atrocity accounts, the research to back it up is very easy to find, and it'll show that it happens, and accepted in several cultures including the Hmong culture.
I am just glad to see more and more Hmong people are dropping this primitive aspect of traditional Hmong wedding customs...
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Why yall gotta be so rude?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIh2xe4jnpk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIh2xe4jnpk)
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I blame the girls parents, who let her go out with a 21 yr old guy in the first place. If she was my daughter I would have grounded her from day one for talking to him. Why do people shift all the blame to the guy? She was willing to spread her legs for him. All a sudden she is innocent because of age, that is BS. I know that when I was that age us girls did worse things out of curiosity and being a rebel to see how far things would go.
Tell that to the prosecutor and the State Legislature. It's ok if both are 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, and even 8/9. :idiot2: There's many flaws in the US laws but Hmong people need to be aware of that. Choice should be left to these bunnies if they agree to get marry, let them be. Because it's impossible to stop people from seeing each other. If the state care so much about Hmong people that they had to charge this guy with false imprisonment, rape, and etc. He needs to just commit suicide for honor(it's too shameful to be labeled as a sex offender/rapist) and have his family sue the state. Just makes me wonder how things would turn out. >:D Instead of a Hmong son inlaw, now the family will probably get a kaydoo because now she's official a whore.
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Force to be marry at 15 years old? I'm 15 right now and I don't know anything about being a mother yet. Lyn don't mind being ask about marriage but she is not sure if kidnapping is the right thing to do, Lyn is much appreciated if the man propose instead.
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UPDATE: Kong Meng Xiong is now sentence for 5 years in prison for criminal sexual conduct charge and 17 months for the false imprisonment charge.
See the updated story here:
http://shrdo.com/index.php/suabhmong-news/2783-shoreview-man-sentenced-to-5-years-for-kidnapping-girl-to-marry-her (http://shrdo.com/index.php/suabhmong-news/2783-shoreview-man-sentenced-to-5-years-for-kidnapping-girl-to-marry-her)
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UPDATE: Kong Meng Xiong is now sentence for 5 years in prison for criminal sexual conduct charge and 17 months for the false imprisonment charge.
See the updated story here:
http://shrdo.com/index.php/suabhmong-news/2783-shoreview-man-sentenced-to-5-years-for-kidnapping-girl-to-marry-her (http://shrdo.com/index.php/suabhmong-news/2783-shoreview-man-sentenced-to-5-years-for-kidnapping-girl-to-marry-her)
Good, the douche bag deserved it for causing such a primitive act...
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I'm not sure what kidnap means "Zij" in hmong. Lis cas los xij, thaum zoo zoo siab ce yeej mus zoo zoo thiab hais zoo, tab sis thaum tsi tshuam haum siab ce yeej yuav hais kom lwm tus txhaum xwb.
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What's wrong with our youth?? Learn and adapt... if you're here, play by the rules here. They throw it in your face everyday, at least learn to use it.
Fine, so the girl don't want to married you... so date someone who is of legal age. Move in with her, excuse the term... F**k to your heart's content and if things don't work out, don't married her. It's all legal now... the Hmong parents can't force you to married her to save face, you're not obligated to married by law and you get to try things out.
Don't look at it as obstacles, look at it as opportunities.
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This is a simple case of nraug laib tham poj laib.
The girl obviously knows that he is older and could get in trouble yet she proceeded to date him as well so they're both GUILTY. She played the Hmong card when it suited her but then turned around and slapped him with the Murica card. His only fault was that he was stupid enough to fall for this crap.
It didn't have to escalate to this level but the girl's parents just want to be a.ssholes because she isn't a virgin anymore. This guy won't be the last older man that she dates.
All in all, the guy was stupid and the girl is evil. Nobody worth applauding or siding with.
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This is a simple case of nraug laib tham poj laib.
The girl obviously knows that he is older and could get in trouble yet she proceeded to date him as well so they're both GUILTY. She played the Hmong card when it suited her but then turned around and slapped him with the Murica card. His only fault was that he was stupid enough to fall for this crap.
It didn't have to escalate to this level but the girl's parents just want to be a.ssholes because she isn't a virgin anymore. This guy won't be the last older man that she dates.
All in all, the guy was stupid and the girl is evil. Nobody worth applauding or siding with.
Some parents are just waiting for this day to happened when their daughter is poj liab. Some parents think when their son is nraug laib if he find someone maybe he would settle down. Honestly, they are all doing it for the wrong reason. Parent with son and daughter like this always feel the greatest or even happiest...... .
In this case turn out the parents are glad they got what they want while she turn the other direction too. Both are evil and could have prevent it. It has to start and end with Hmong letting go of this practice where it is all about saving face, quick $$, etc. Nowadays the only difference is that girl are barely kidnapped, guy trap when dropping off the girl home, etc. It become more of young girl getting pregnant and then the parents of the guy have no choice to do the Hmong wedding sooner or later. I have a nephew like that and just last year had their wedding in May and then baby born a few weeks later. Her qhi tau hau was $6800. Next month another baby already. My sil and bil got sick and tired of their son thinking they can kick him out when he's 18 yo because he drop out of high school. My husband been telling his brother your son is no different than the rest of the nephews....
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Some parents are just waiting for this day to happened when their daughter is poj liab. Some parents think when their son is nraug laib if he find someone maybe he would settle down. Honestly, they are all doing it for the wrong reason. Parent with son and daughter like this always feel the greatest or even happiest...... .
In this case turn out the parents are glad they got what they want while she turn the other direction too. Both are evil and could have prevent it. It has to start and end with Hmong letting go of this practice where it is all about saving face, quick $$, etc. Nowadays the only difference is that girl are barely kidnapped, guy trap when dropping off the girl home, etc. It become more of young girl getting pregnant and then the parents of the guy have no choice to do the Hmong wedding sooner or later. I have a nephew like that and just last year had their wedding in May and then baby born a few weeks later. Her qhi tau hau was $6800. Next month another baby already. My sil and bil got sick and tired of their son thinking they can kick him out when he's 18 yo because he drop out of high school. My husband been telling his brother your son is no different than the rest of the nephews....
It didn't have to escalate to this level. It's pretty clear both are fully aware of the consequences if leaked out to the American authorities. This girl is likely in rebellious mode against her parents and that's why she was dating this older guy who happens to be what Hmong parents consider ib tug laib.
These days if a girl doesn't want to marry then just come home. No need to make anybody pay fines or fees. Cov hluas nim no tsis muaj kev xu siab lawm os thiab lawv tsis khe txog lawv lub ntsej muag so no need to demand retributions.
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Born and raised here in the US and he is this stupid? This dude is stupid. Many professions will not even allow this dude to be around their properties . :o :o
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I have a Mien buddy who I went to elementary, middle, part of college with. He transfer over, we met, talk and even hung out. But then after a couple month, he didn't respond to my text. I thought nothing of it. Early this year, I was told by his other friends he's been in prison for a while now for the same reasons similar to this one, with the exception of attempting to get married.
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we should not question this guy, but we should question the hmong 18xeem. tell them not to live like tribal people and stop their day-dreams about giving all hmong people as a second class citizen. if these OG would to stop doing what they are doing nowadays. let us hmong people immigrate right into the 21st century. because the law of the land and its principle that we must live up to...
you MN people should tell 18 xeem to come and taking care of this matter. if they cannot even play apart of it, then tell them to stop what they are doing and should assimilate into the main stream America--and act like one because more cases like this.
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:idiot2:Ruam tiag.. blaming the 18 xeem for this matter. If Hmong ppl follow 18 xeem and Hmong tridition this would not be an issue. You forget that 18 xeem are full of educated Hmong people. If you are not in the 21st century then get with it.
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The report doesn't state who called the police.
If the girl changed her mind then let her go home and then her parents should just let it be. But you know this is all about trying to save her face, too. If the parents disagreed with the age gap then they could've ended the relationship long ago before any of this. But again, poj laib thiab nraug laib xwb ces will always create drama.
My advice to Hmong guys is don't ask Hmong gals to marry you. Don't go zij lawv and definitely do not go nqis tsev hais. Just let them move themselves into your parents' house because many of them are already doing that anyways.
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My thoughts exactly. I'm so sick of hearing Hmong people say "this is america" like they're model American citizens above others and that kidnapping and statutory rape doesn't already happen in this country. This guy's morals are socially frowned upon, but at least he was willing to take responsibility the way he knew. I don't condone his actions, and thankfully the parents did the right thing because I'm sure this marriage would eventually crash due to the cultural differences, but some of these "Hmong Americans" got to stop acting like a snob.
I disagree. Regardless of whether or not someone is a "model" American, the law is the law. This has nothing to do with someone viewing himself/herself above another; rather, it has everything to do with the fact that here in the United States, kidnapping someone is considered an illegal act that is punishable by law. This is regardless of whether the committer was White, Black, Hmong, or some other ethnicity.
Just because statutory rape happens in the United States doesn't mean it's okay to do it. Just because kidnapping happens in the United States doesn't mean it's okay to do it. All of those acts, if brought to the proper authorities, are investigated. If convicted and found guilty, the committers are sentenced to the appropriate punishment as allotted by the law. Following your logic, it would go to state that just because theft happens in Thailand, regardless of whether or not you condone my actions, it would be okay for me to steal from another Hmong person in Thailand; furthermore, that they shouldn't say anything about it because it already happens there anyway. Should they step up and call the authorities to report that I have stolen something from them, they should be viewed as "Hmong Thai Snobs" because their actions sided with protecting their best interest. How absurd is that?
What is wrong with our people in this country is the basic fact that they think that American Law does not apply to them because they are Hmong. Due to cultural stereotypes that have been passed from one generation to the next, most people are too scared to stand up for their rights; mainly woman. This is especially true because in the Hmong culture, women have no rights and are treated like chattel; bought and sold for a price.
As we become more integrated with American society, cultural biases will be tested; case in point, the action of this young man. If you read the story further, it states that he committed a similar crime to a thirteen year old victim. This is his second offense, that is publicly known, and is not acceptable. I would've thought he would've learned his lesson after the first time.
I, for one, am glad that this girl's parents are pressing charges. Someone needs to set the precedence that it is not okay to take our young Hmong daughters, sisters, and cousins against their wills to become someone's bride. If I'm not mistaken, where my parents came from, men old enough to be my grandfather could have someone as young as my little cousin kidnapped to be his bride for no other reason than because he wanted her. This is a very arbitrary way of thinking and archaic way of life.
Living here in America means that I have rights and freedoms. Those do, however, come with a price tag. I can, for the most part, do as I wish; practice whatever religion I'd like, speak to whomever I want, live wherever I please, do whatever I'd like for a living, etc. However, if I commit a crime that is illegal, I will have to pay the consequence of said crime. This applies to everyone. Hmong people are not excluded from this and are not exceptions to the law.
I am, by law, protected from criminal acts, like kidnapping and assault, and heinous crimes like domestic violence and rape...to name a few. I choose to exercise my rights as a Hmong American and file charges should any of these acts happen to me, a loved one, or a daughter if I have one someday. If you choose not to exercise your rights, that's your choice. That doesn't give you the right to call someone names because they're using rights that you are choosing to ignore.
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I blame the girls parents, who let her go out with a 21 yr old guy in the first place. If she was my daughter I would have grounded her from day one for talking to him. Why do people shift all the blame to the guy? She was willing to spread her legs for him. All a sudden she is innocent because of age, that is BS. I know that when I was that age us girls did worse things out of curiosity and being a rebel to see how far things would go.
This is a rather unfair and judgmental statement. Parents often have little or no control over what their kids do. In fact, control is an illusion. They raise them the best way that they can and hope that their children are smart enough to make wise decisions. A parent's job is not to "control" their child and dictate their child's life. A parent's job is to be a guide, support system, and comforter for their children.
Regardless of whether she "spread her legs", as you so diligently put it, it didn't give him the right to accept her offer because he knew that she was underage and it was illegal. He didn't have to sleep with her. He didn't have to date her. No one put a gun to his head and made him do anything. He did, however, take her against her will. With regard to coitus prior to this happening, she is not of age to consent so even if she willingly offered, he couldn't accept anyway.
You weren't in this relationship. You don't know what led up to the first time they had coitus. You are a completely different person than she is. To judge her would mean to allow others to judge you for your..."curiosity" and "rebel" ways as a teenager. Like you said, you did worse things...which I can't even begin to imagine. People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
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The guy knew what he was doing. He raped a little girl and he's going to prison for it.
#Big****bobiswaiting