Hmong DNA

[zina]

http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=293504
All the Hmong groups DNA.



http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=293705
Hmong Daw DNA

What fascinated me was the D-M15 and N3(Tat) DNA.
Hmong Daw has more of each.(download the chart from the link)
What puzzles me is when did the Hmong Daw moved to Laos??  Was it before the Ming Dynasty?  How do you explain the Yakuts DNA?  Its a Siberia DNA.

[AOZ]

what's the signifance behind D-M15 and N3(Tat) DNA again? 

[AOZ]

help me understand my history.... i'm referring to anything dating to before our time in Laos.... documenting our movements supporting our dna.

where are we historically written in those histories?  kthank.

[HUNG TU LO]

what's the signifance behind D-M15 and N3(Tat) DNA again?

It's just a marker and doesn't mean anything by itself. But the frequency of it and comparing it among other people's is when these markers get interesting because it can possible paint a picture of your people's journey since the dawn of mankind.

M130

If you look at the frequency chart (near the middle of the page), it appears we have more frequency of M130 than Han Chinese and Koreans. In other words, this study suggests Hmoob are more related to Altaic, northern Asian people (Mongolians, Siberians, etc) than eastern Asian Han Chinese and Koreans.

But remember, it's a study based on scientific thought and scientific thought is not truth-seeking. And this is not history. Be very careful of what you interpret to be actual history from this study.

Don't be like that idiot on asiafinest and start calling markers as "Hmong gene marker" and claiming us as "the one true Hmong". Because while the study shows that Hmong have 33% of M7 marker frequency, Zaomin, Bunu and She northern subjects of this study shows a 32%, 30% and 25%, respectively. I doubt these people would accept being called "Hmong relatives", vice versa.

[zina]

what's the signifance behind D-M15 and N3(Tat) DNA again? 

D-M15 is the strand of DNA that is Qin, Qiang, Tibetans & central Asia.  The Qin were supposed to be the exciled San Miao in ancient China to Gansu.  At 8% its fairly high outside of Tibet.  N1c(Tat) is a Siberian DNA with the Yakutsk in Siberia. At 6%??  Extreme high so far South.  How did Hmong get these in Laos???  You see why it is interesting.

[zina]

help me understand my history.... i'm referring to anything dating to before our time in Laos.... documenting our movements supporting our dna.

where are we historically written in those histories?  kthank.

According to Chinese text, we were in Shangdong as Donyi [N1c(Tat)]. Then as San Miao moving first to where Chu was later founded on the Yangtze, then to Gansu where Qin [D-M15] was founded.  In Gansu the San Miao were call Qiang.  These Qiang moved West to central Asia and Tibet.

[zina]

But remember, it's a study based on scientific thought and scientific thought is not truth-seeking. And this is not history. Be very careful of what you interpret to be actual history from this study.

Science is not truth seeking? Wow.... Someone have issues about science.  Science is focus on facts.  Some may manipulate it but it will be discover.

[HUNG TU LO]

@zina

Science is the study. It is a thought process. To research something, gather data, possibly correlate the shit, and say something on the subject. Science doesn't care what is true and false. It is concerned with what is, and what is not.

Please don't patronize me. I have a B.S. in sociology and completely understand what science is as well as what it is not.

[chidorix0x]

HUNG TU LO,

U r a BS-Sociology,  -- explains a lot  ...   

@zina,

Good info.  This is the kind of "science" I've been looking for, for a while now versus all the myths, folklore, hear-say, and sociological/anthropological studies/scholarships.  Good stuff, though sadly it will be difficult to soldify any "truth", esp. among sociologists - 

[zina]

@zina

Science is the study. It is a thought process. To research something, gather data, possibly correlate the shit, ad say something on the subject. Science doesn't care what is true and false. It is concerned with what is, and what is not.

Please don't patronize me. I have a B.S. in sociology and completely understand what science is as well as what it is not.

Sociology...  That explains the remark.  Not in the natural sciences and business world when the truth/what works matters.  Everything has to be written down so it could be duplicated and tested before resources are allocated to it.

I'm confused as to what is your contention.  Are you saying the DNA study is fake?  Have you even looked at O-M7 to see why it was labeled Hmong?  Did he decide to label it himself? Or was it labeled by the researchers?  As a 'scientist' I assume you would look at the sources and the study itself before saying it is questionable.

[zina]

HUNG TU LO,

U r a BS-Sociology,  -- explains a lot  ...   

@zina,

Good info.  This is the kind of "science" I've been looking for, for a while now versus all the myths, folklore, hear-say, and sociological/anthropological studies/scholarships.  Good stuff, though sadly it will be difficult to soldify any "truth", esp. among sociologists - 

This is just the beginning.  I understand there has been private DNA analysises by the Wu clan and many are Hmong.  In addition, they apparently have a secret study done by Mao Tse Tung on the Hmong's origin.  Apparently the timing was just not right for the release yet.

[YeejKoob13]

Zina,

Thanks for sharing this info with us here. I've been looking for something like this for awhile now. If all of what I read is accurate then now we can tell the Hmong Christians and other ppl to politely zip it about us being the lost tribe of Isreal, etc, so they can manipulate the info to convert us Hmong over into a foreign religion/culture.

Personally I'd like to see my own DNA composition. To the best of my knowledge all my ancestors going back to the 1700's were/are all "Hmong" with no "outside" blood/marriages.

[TruthAboveKnowledge]

Lets forget about what you would say is "Hmong" DNA.  Lets go farther back in time.  Science has shown that Humans originated in Africa.  Lets see if there are any scientific proof that Hmongs have DNA gene(s) related to Africans?  People who refute that Hmong people did not originate in Africa contradicts scientific evidence. 

In HmongKnight's thread about "map of Qhuab Kev..." I simply said that there are many evidence that Hmong culture and practices show a very high degree of relationship relating to the Israelites.  And then another member spoke out as Hmongs being the lost tribe of Israel.  I have information on what the "Lost Tribes of Israel" means and that is a totally different subject to talk about.  What I was pointing to were the facts that the religious practices by Hmong shamans and the Hmong belief, culture and traditions show a very close relationship between the two.  Take for example, who taught the Hmongs how to burn incense...afte r all, no hmong that I am aware of even knows how to make incense.  The closest thing the Hmong has to making incense is burning paper.  Here's another common practice regarding alter.  Hmong people make alters to worship.  Obviously, where did this alter making for worshipping come about in the Hmong history because building and making alters were recorded in the Bible a long time ago prior to Hmong history if we even can go that far.  Hmong people use animal sacrifices, so who taught them or when did animal sacrifices first started for the Hmongs?  Hmongs use the Bull or cow as one of the highest sacrificial animal as offering, so did the Israelites from Egypt...and they have record of it...Hmong people don't.  My question is why didn't the Hmong use a monkey or a snake.  The practices of certain methodology are very similar. 

So going back to genetic markers and such.  Ghenghis Khan was a mighty conquerer who has left his genetic trait and marker.  Science has proven that one out of every 8 person on Earth has that genetic marker.  Khan being a mongol drink milk as a form of getting their vitamins.  So do the Hmong people drink milk....NO they don't because Hmongs are a nomadic people.  The majority do not herd animals and for the few who do, they do not drink the milk of animals.  Hmong people are gypsies who  roam about what they can grow or gather, hence their understanding of using stone and masonry are very limited. 

[TruthAboveKnowledge]

Oh, and for the record the Chinese government during the Chinese Revolution destroyed all documentary books and studies within their own country.  This was purposely done to hinder all knowledge and history of all other ethnic groups.  The only required reading was Mao's little red book. 

The chinese government destroyed all factual record and evidence, and the mission against the Dalai Lama was to secure and destroy all of the secrets and history that was hidden at the temple also.  Record of Kings and rulers to the very secrets of a particular people were hidden at the temple.  What better way to destroy a people by erasing their history and origin?  Their language and culture, their philosophy and leaders.

[night912]

You forgot the part about sprinkling water to the person who is getting healed. Different but similar at the same time.