We Need a Hmong Leader

[bulbasaur]

To some people's surprise, I am actually not completely against the idea.  I am usually against the ideas that people propose about this.  I am usually against the views of the people who are already kinda doing this stuff.  Many people are corrupt, and many have their own agendas.  I don't want to point out any names, but you probably know them.  So why do I feel we still need a Hmong leader? 

When I say "leader," I really mean "activist."    We don't need Hmong leaders planning some crazy plot to overthrow Laos.  However, we probably need some individuals to help promote education, social change, etc.  For example, Chai Vang and now Dylan Yang.  Whatever your views on their guilt or innocence, or whatever your views on their sentencing, there is one major problem:  They both had awful representation .

[duckwingduck]

why not you? 

[zena]

I just ate a huge Tallimook ice cream sandwich so I might not make a lot of sense but...

I think a good leader/activist for the Hmong should work on getting rid of the bride price/bride purchase and domestic violence within the Hmong community.

[hmgROCK]

Chai vang, he ran and gun down all those meeka
That's a little bit crazy


Dylan yang, after 1-2 bb shot, you know it's a fake gun. He chose to grab a k ife

[bulbasaur]

I believe people should have a passion for whatever they do in life, and I have my own pursuits.  I make changes to the world in my own small ways.  This kind of work is for people who have a passion for it.  Unfortunately, all the qualified individuals might be too cynical, and so leaving only the corrupt. 

It's just sad that Dylan Yang got such awful representation .  I hear there are lots of Hmong lawyers out there now, but where are they?  With today's communication and social media, this should have been nipped, especially after the Chai Vang case.  At one point in my life, I wanted to be a lawyer.  If I went that route, I would have flown over and done the case for free, or at least, advise the family.  For goodness sake, no one even advised the family to change representation .  WTH? 

why not you?

[bulbasaur]

It is not a matter of guilt or sentencing.  It is a matter of representation .  What if a completely innocent person gets accused?  He or she will get represented the same way, and that is not okay.  That being said, let's look at what went wrong in both those cases...

1. Chai Vang.  He should have NEVER taken the stand.  His lawyers did not prep him.  His lawyers should have known that his limited English would make him seem cold.  His lawyers did not even object during the DA's questioning.  WTH? 

2. Dylan Yang.  Lawyers should have never let him talk to the police alone.  Heck, he probably should have never talked to the police at all.  There is a time to explain your side of the story, and that is in the courtroom, not the police station.  Every decent lawyer knows this.  It's in the Miranda Rights: "You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say may be used against you in a court of law...."  Notice that those Miranda Rights say nothing about helping you in a court of law; it is only going to be used against you.  Thus, don't talk to cops.  Dylan Yang got a shitty lawyer. 

Chai vang, he ran and gun down all those meeka
That's a little bit crazy


Dylan yang, after 1-2 bb shot, you know it's a fake gun. He chose to grab a k ife

[bulbasaur]

This is where I part ways with what activists should do....

1.  I don't believe the bride price (or any tradition) should be monitored any one person or group.  Such traditions are not hurting anyone, and those traditions are important to some people.  If it is not important to you, then you have every right to not practice it as well. 

2. As far as domestic violence....Un fortunately, I don't think it can be fully eliminated.  There are just nutty people out there.  However, there probably should be some form of education for children, and there probably be some service to help the victims get out of their situation. 

I just ate a huge Tallimook ice cream sandwich so I might not make a lot of sense but...

I think a good leader/activist for the Hmong should work on getting rid of the bride price/bride purchase and domestic violence within the Hmong community.

[bulbasaur]

There is always a group doing something.  As much as the older generation like to bash on this new generation, that is one thing kids today are decent at.  Thank you social media. 

Activist. Yes.
Someone who has extensive knowledge and experience of the Hmong ethnic group and can advocate and represent them. Yes.

The idea of a "leader" atleast from what most people put it where the leader is like the president or dictator then no. 

IIRC. There's a group trying to do this, I ran into them at new year.  They were called Hmong Innovative Politics. Have you checked them out?
I only briefly spoke to them about the Right to Die Bill/ Death With Dignity/etc. and they didn't have much information for me.

[bulbasaur]

I heard there's drama at a Hmong school.  I don't know all the details, but.....yeah. 

[bulbasaur]

Something like that.  I am sure both sides think they are in the right.  The truth is probably somewhere in the middle. 

Think that's the Hmong charter school that something like 50 non-union staff was let go?

[zena]

This is where I part ways with what activists should do....

1.  I don't believe the bride price (or any tradition) should be monitored any one person or group.  Such traditions are not hurting anyone, and those traditions are important to some people.  If it is not important to you, then you have every right to not practice it as well. 

2. As far as domestic violence....Un fortunately, I don't think it can be fully eliminated.  There are just nutty people out there.  However, there probably should be some form of education for children, and there probably be some service to help the victims get out of their situation.

You did say, and I quote: we probably need some individuals to help promote education, social change, etc.  Unfortunately, you want an activist who jives with your thinking and not for the better of the Hmong community as a whole.  Bride price is a big no no and no matter how anyone argues it, it will always be wrong.  You call it a practice but it's not a practice.  It's called buying a slave.  Hmong domestic violence is completely out of hand.  I hear more about Hmong husbands killing his wife because she was cheating or wanting a divorce than any other race.  So primitive.  Promoting education would likely decrease immensely both of these.  Yet, you don't think those two things are anyone's business.  Hmm.

As for Dylan Yang, it's just too bad.  He was in the wrong.  His parents should have moved him out of that community into a better community when they knew he was being bullied.  I don't believe he was all so innocent.  They were wrong but I think Dylan provoked them too.  This is a situation where I hope the large Hmong community in Wisconsin learn that they have to change too.  You can't hate on another race/culture and expect them to love yours.  If you want them to change their ways, you gotta change yours.  For instance as parents, if you want the bullying to stop, you need to step foot inside the school and volunteer your time.  Get to know the kids.  Learn who the problem ones are.  They bully because they are being bullied either from family or other friends.  If you can't help them, and you know things can get heated, then get out.  Go somewhere safer.

[bulbasaur]

So the last time I was at a function, there were just scams everywhere.  Some people might ask your salary because they have a professional interest.  Some are seeing how much they are scam you. 

Some OG's ask because they equate money to intelligence and stature, and thus, qualifications for leadership.  I disagree, but that is probably the environment they grew up in.  Of course, all these OG's want  leaders, but they don't seem to have any goals to be led to.  It just all seem like pseudo-respect points.  "Our clan is awesome!  We should be the leader.  No, our clan is awesome!  We should be the leader!"  At the end of the day, everyone goes back home. 

[yuknowthat]

lam hais tas pov tseg xwb nawb,


Yog hais txog qhov yuav nrhiav ib tug coj los sawv cev peb haiv hmoob kom ua ib pab ib pawg. Yuav nrhiav nyuaj heev. Yeej muaj ntau tus kawm siab kawg, yeej muaj ntau tus txawj ntse kawg tiamsi tsis muaj tus Siab Loj txaus los lis lus luag hauj lwm.

Siab Loj li cas? you might asked.

example: Like one of the wonderful hmong man in this world had said "hnub kuv txiav txim muab kuv txoj sia rau hmoob kiag lawm, yog hnub kuv yuav ua kom hmoob tau lub neej vam meej. "

Yuav hlub/qhuab qhia/txhawb tau tus ruam, tus siab luv, thiab tus tsis muaj peev xwm kom zoo dua qhov qub.

tsis yog thaum zoo ces tus twg los xav xyuas tes taum , thaum kub ntxhov ces tus twg los nrhiav kev nkaum.

[bulbasaur]

*yawns*  I know this might be a shock to you, but you should consider that you are actually doing what you are accusing me of: "Unfortunately, you want an activist who jives with your thinking and not for the better of the Hmong community as a whole."

I originally wrote a long exposition about the bride price because you are wrong on it, but this isn't really about the bride price. The bride price is really another discussion.  This is really about....

If you really want to police moral values through leaders and activists, you should consider if there will ever be the day when you are the receiving end.  If Hmong leaders and activists are allowed to police values and practices, then there is a very good chance that you will be persecuted.  Hmong Christians love judging others, but they hate to be judged themselves.  What if leaders and activists declare that Christianity is a moral wrong, what are you going to do? 

The difference between you and me is tolerance.  I don't believe that admonishing other people's belief builds a better society.  Education leads to understanding.  Ignorance leads to hate and violence.  I can tolerate and understand the bride price as I can tolerate and understand your views against it.  I wouldn't want someone to force the bride price on you, which is why I disagree with you forcing this view onto them. 

Whatever your views on the Dylan Yang situation, he didn't get fair representation .

You did say, and I quote: we probably need some individuals to help promote education, social change, etc.  Unfortunately, you want an activist who jives with your thinking and not for the better of the Hmong community as a whole.  Bride price is a big no no and no matter how anyone argues it, it will always be wrong.  You call it a practice but it's not a practice.  It's called buying a slave.  Hmong domestic violence is completely out of hand.  I hear more about Hmong husbands killing his wife because she was cheating or wanting a divorce than any other race.  So primitive.  Promoting education would likely decrease immensely both of these.  Yet, you don't think those two things are anyone's business.  Hmm.

As for Dylan Yang, it's just too bad.  He was in the wrong.  His parents should have moved him out of that community into a better community when they knew he was being bullied.  I don't believe he was all so innocent.  They were wrong but I think Dylan provoked them too.  This is a situation where I hope the large Hmong community in Wisconsin learn that they have to change too.  You can't hate on another race/culture and expect them to love yours.  If you want them to change their ways, you gotta change yours.  For instance as parents, if you want the bullying to stop, you need to step foot inside the school and volunteer your time.  Get to know the kids.  Learn who the problem ones are.  They bully because they are being bullied either from family or other friends.  If you can't help them, and you know things can get heated, then get out.  Go somewhere safer.

[nightrider]

I'm sorry, but if I'm not getting paid. I'm not doing it.lol C'man, most of these ogs want to run the show but all they do is fight among them selves and not doing much of anything to better the community or people. The so called betterment or serving the community by trying to write proposals to the state and have the state ratify or honor our worthless system. So people can be more controlled by the state, they're a bunch of messed up coops. You're talking about grand Dragon master "rabbis", Hmongolian Culture Experts, Funeral "priest", and the sort. I can't imagine earning $2k in a few hrs of service over the funeral weekend and be taxed on it.

But anyways, it's hard to be an activist or step up to the plate and become a leader when every day average people are still struggling to make a living. Important point is, there's no enough people who will be able to make donations to run such movements.

Even for folks whom wants to run for official city positions or entering government. Please don't run and expect donation money from the hmong community averaging $100/person. This f-king democrazy system is just too much burden on people and it's unsustainable. .. Just let the white men sit in the office, we go do our sh!+ at the flea market, at the very least you have the money to hold.