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Author Topic: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child  (Read 2178 times)

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Offline DuMa

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #30 on: March 13, 2019, 09:26:58 PM »
Now put your own foot into the situation.  Kids are all grown up, you are retired, what is it that you expect out of your kids?

The right answer for me is absolutely nothing.  My job as a father is done once my kids have wings to fly.  If they want to visit me or come back to the nest, the door is wide open but i will not expect them to visit me and worry about me.  It is all optional.  Why?

Cuz kids in America behave differently so it all depends on what school of thought you want to live your life with.

If anything, I want my kids to visit their kids and their wife.  Build up their own foundation and stop expecting from people.  You will be disappointed if you expect people to behave the way you want them to behave and not getting it. 



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"There is a party up in here... Fawk you over there"  ha

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Offline Luna

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #31 on: March 13, 2019, 09:35:39 PM »
He shouldn't have to speak up as they already seen how much he's doing for his and their parents already and they know his resources as a care provider. From the information I gathered, even if he speaks up, I don't think they care. Keep in mind that spending 5 minutes on the phone with their parents is already too much to ask. Also based on the information disclosed to me, the only reason why they are throwing these fake events is to protect their own reputations as the community have also seen how much their parents have sacrificed for them when they needed them over the years. Every time they do these fake events, the parents complain and cry more to my friend but he can't do much about it as his siblings are older and should know better. Which is why I suggest the parents speak up, be honest and reject these fake events that will just cause more pain for them...and when the members of the community asked, just be honest...

He shouldn't have to speak up but because they dont care, he has to make his voice heard.  The OGs won't say or do anything because either way, they are benefiting.  Your friend is enabling his siblings by staying.  As sad as it may seem, your friend has to physically leave this situation so that his parents and sibling can see all that he does.  He's not abandoning the parents since it'll force his siblings to step up.  Sometimes we have to be selfish and take care of our own mental health too. 



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #32 on: March 13, 2019, 10:39:26 PM »
He shouldn't have to speak up but because they dont care, he has to make his voice heard.  The OGs won't say or do anything because either way, they are benefiting.  Your friend is enabling his siblings by staying.  As sad as it may seem, your friend has to physically leave this situation so that his parents and sibling can see all that he does.  He's not abandoning the parents since it'll force his siblings to step up.  Sometimes we have to be selfish and take care of our own mental health too.

My friend hasn't spoken up against them asking him to help out financially equally even though they should know better especially since they are able to freely pursue their career goals and he had to put his aside for his "Hmong" role but I think he should too and if they disagree, just not pitch in or participate as his siblings and their parents already what how much he has done. Plus, he's not really a fan of his older siblings doing these events for shows anyways since it doesn't benefit his parents.

As far as his parents' pain and complaints go, he has spoken up and told his older siblings about it but they still don't visit or even make phone calls so it's up to the parents to speak up, be honest and reject those fake parent honoring events. If the parents don't speak up for themselves and continue to partake in these for "face" and show events, and then complain to my friend behind closed doors about it, they also have themselves to blame.



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Offline dogmai

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2019, 01:07:00 PM »
Nope, didn't tell my friend to do that ("refusing to let" his siblings visit the parents) so you're wrong on that...I told him that if his parents are hurt by the way his older siblings do things just for show to protect their own reputations or for whatever selfish reasons, they (the parents) need to speak up, be honest and reject those for "face" event instead of complaining to him about it behind close doors afterward. The parents don't have the heart to speak up but if they do, their words should have more impact than my friend relaying the message to his older siblings like a messenger. If the parents continue to partake even thought it hurts, they also have themselves to blame ...Simply put: only the parents can really stop the pain that are bothering them and have some closure from it.

Rejecting to let them do the events is refusing to let them visit if that's the only time that they do visit. And that results in the parents not be able to see them.

Like you said, actions are more important than words, and their actions speaks for themselves. The parent's actions are saying that they do want the events. They choose to let their children do the events and get to see them instead of hurting them and rejecting them and not able to see them. So it is refusing to let the parents see them.



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2019, 05:03:47 PM »
Rejecting to let them do the events is refusing to let them visit if that's the only time that they do visit. And that results in the parents not be able to see them.

Like you said, actions are more important than words, and their actions speaks for themselves. The parent's actions are saying that they do want the events. They choose to let their children do the events and get to see them instead of hurting them and rejecting them and not able to see them. So it is refusing to let the parents see them.

Wrong again, I've never told my friend to "refusing to let" his siblings visit the parents...In fact, he would like them to visit more often with genuine care so his parents would complain less to him.

Where did you pull the wrong statement claiming I told my friend that he needs to "refuse" to let his older siblings visit the parents?

What I said is his parents need to be upfront and honest and reject these fake for "face" events if it's just gonna cause more pain. The parents don't want it because it's not genuine but they don't have the heart to speak up and tell the truth. However, they have no problems complaining to my friend behind closed door about it afterward.

If the visitation or time spent together is fake, it doesn't matter if it's one visit or 100 visits, it just causes more pain for the parents especially when they think of all the times they've sacrificed for their older kids that are neglecting them now...




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Offline dogmai

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #35 on: March 15, 2019, 12:00:29 AM »
Wrong again, I've never told my friend to "refusing to let" his siblings visit the parents... You said it yourself, actions are more important than words. The act to refuse is the result from your advice. Here's the Facts: Event occurs, siblings visiting parents. Event doesn't occur, siblings not visiting parents. Siblings have event, siblings are there with parents. Have no event, no siblings with parents.  Accept event, event occurs, siblings are present. Reject event, no event, siblings are not present. You could say, but if they didn't do it for show, they are allow to do it. That still doesn't change the fact that your advice refused them to visit.

In fact, he would like them to visit more often with genuine care so his parents would complain less to him. This is irrelevant because it was not your advice, just a poor excuse to draw attention from your advice. Therefore, it's dismiss.

Where did you pull the wrong statement claiming I told my friend that he needs to "refuse" to let his older siblings visit the parents? That's the excuse that many people use when they don't want to take responsibility .

What I said is his parents need to be upfront and honest and reject these fake for "face" events if it's just gonna cause more pain. The parents don't want it because it's not genuine but they don't have the heart to speak up and tell the truth. However, they have no problems complaining to my friend behind closed door about it afterward.

If the visitation or time spent together is fake, it doesn't matter if it's one visit or 100 visits, it just causes more pain for the parents especially when they think of all the times they've sacrificed for their older kids that are neglecting them now...It depends, some people want to just spend time with the people they love regardless of the reason. That's more important to them. But that's besides the point, the matter of fact is that you gave a bad advice. The reason why it's bad is because it's based on your view regarding on the way you feel about people "faking" or doing things for "show". And because of that, it fails to recognize the bad results that comes with it. You failed to see the real dilemma, that is, how the parents feel.    You went from the parents wanting to see more of their children, then jumped to defending your stance on people "faking". It's evident when you avoided my comment and started the defense of your stance with you and your siblings regarding your mom, missing the whole point.



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #36 on: March 15, 2019, 02:08:09 AM »

You said it yourself, actions are more important than words. The act to refuse is the result from your advice. Here's the Facts: Event occurs, siblings visiting parents. Event doesn't occur, siblings not visiting parents. Siblings have event, siblings are there with parents. Have no event, no siblings with parents.  Accept event, event occurs, siblings are present. Reject event, no event, siblings are not present. You could say, but if they didn't do it for show, they are allow to do it. That still doesn't change the fact that your advice refused them to visit.

You're still missing the point of the parents don't want "fake" visit just so the older siblings can protect their own reputations in the eyes of the community. They rather not participate but don't have the heart to speak up based on the complaints they've made to my friend.

Quote
This is irrelevant because it was not your advice, just a poor excuse to draw attention from your advice. Therefore, it's dismiss.

That's the excuse that many people use when they don't want to take responsibility .

As expected, nothing to back your made up BS claim of falsely accusing me telling my friend, he should "refused" his older siblings visiting their parents.

Quote
It depends, some people want to just spend time with the people they love regardless of the reason. That's more important to them. But that's besides the point, the matter of fact is that you gave a bad advice. The reason why it's bad is because it's based on your view regarding on the way you feel about people "faking" or doing things for "show". And because of that, it fails to recognize the bad results that comes with it. You failed to see the real dilemma, that is, how the parents feel.    You went from the parents wanting to see more of their children, then jumped to defending your stance on people "faking". It's evident when you avoided my comment and started the defense of your stance with you and your siblings regarding your mom, missing the whole point.

Wrong again, not in this case as the issue is clearly stated.. now you're making up more stuff with "based on your view"...The pain that the parents go through is already clearly stated based on the info I got from my friend but your poor reading comp issues continues to fail you. The parents DO want to see their older children more but it has be genuine, not a fake event just to make them look good in front of the community. Every time the older children do these fake events, it hurts the parents more...which is why I say, they need to speak up, be honest and reject it instead of just complaining to my friend about it afterward.

Show me the "comment" of yours that I've avoided...I bet nothing just like the made up "he's refusing to let his siblings visit their parents" BS claim...talk about "missing the whole point"...



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Offline ZDN

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2019, 08:17:53 AM »
LOL...theking and his ignorant rhetorics, he can't accept THE FACT that he made an ill advised suggestion to his friend (denouncing the siblings).  it's just common sense, that following through with his advice would tear the family further apart. friends don't give friends bad advice! ha!



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Offline techy

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2019, 06:17:32 PM »
There is always two sides to a story.  Get the perspective from the older siblings too before passing judgement. 

If I was in the youngest son situation, I would make the best of the situation. Enjoy time with my parents.  Spending time with our parents is never a waste of time.  So what if the other siblings don't want to spend time with our parents.  That is their lost.  If we manage to keep our parents happy enough, they will have less time to worry about the other siblings not calling them.  Our parents tears are a direct reflection of our failure as much as our other siblings.

In terms of responsibiliti es for our kids or parents, I am with Duma on this though. We shouldn't expect our kids to look after us, should they chose not to.  But if we role model the love that we like our kids to follow (love our parents with sincerity), then more than likely our own kids will value the same and love us the same way (whether we expect them to or not).   



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #39 on: March 16, 2019, 12:29:22 AM »
There is always two sides to a story.  Get the perspective from the older siblings too before passing judgement. 

True in many cases. I probably will never get my friend's older siblings side but going by the information I received, if it's that painful for the parents, my suggestion is still the same: the parents need to speak up, be honest about how they feel about those fake for "face" and show in front of the community functions, and stop participating in it.  If not then they also have themselves to blame so no need complain behind closed door to my friend about it afterward..

My friend already told his older siblings about the pain and complaints from his aging and ailing parents when it comes to those for show functions as well as they can't even spend a few minutes to make a phone call to say hi and check up on their parents and it didn't do any good so the expression of pain and sadness should come straight from the parents. They were the ones that actually made the sacrifices for their older children when they needed them so it's only fitting that they speak up about how they really feel about the whole thing.



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Offline dogmai

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #40 on: March 16, 2019, 11:51:41 PM »
First of all, you just buried your whole argument. Second, FACTS beat ignorance. Third, you are the one that don't fully understand what "reading comprehension" means or you're just dismissing what I have presented. Reading comprehension is not just about being able to read the words or know their definition. Being able to understand the meaning of what is written down plays a big part.

You're still missing the point of the parents don't want "fake" visit just so the older siblings can protect their own reputations in the eyes of the community.Failed. And I'll show you why below.

 They rather not participate but don't have the heart to speak up based on the complaints they've made to my friend. Failed again. Why? Because action is more important than words. Come up with whatever excuse (words) you want, but it still doesn't change the FACT that they choose to participate (action) in the events. 

As expected, nothing to back your made up BS claim of falsely accusing me telling my friend, he should "refused" his older siblings visiting their parents.

Failed again.
re·ject
verb
gerund or present participle: rejecting
/rəˈjekt/
dismiss as inadequate, inappropriate, or not to one's taste.
"union negotiators rejected a 1.5 percent pay increase"
refuse to agree to (a request).
"an application to hold a pop concert at the club was rejected"
synonyms:   turn down, refuse, decline, say no to;

Siblings visit parents because event is going on. Rejecting (synonym for refusing) to do event = No event going on, so no siblings visiting. Reading comprehension is needed required here.


Wrong again, not in this case as the issue is clearly stated.. now you're making up more stuff with "based on your view"...Failed again.
 
True in many cases. I probably will never get my friend's older siblings side but going by the information I received,


Instead of getting all the FACTS from all the people involved, you made an ignorant claim based on your view.
[/color]

Show me the "comment" of yours that I've avoided...I bet nothing just like the made up "he's refusing to let his siblings visit their parents" BS claim...talk about "missing the whole point"...

:2funny:  :2funny: LMAO After all those fails, you decided to copy the Hmong Notrodomus, resulting in another failure.

Bad news for you, because you just lost the bet.  :2funny:

My comment.
Imagine how she feels regardless of whether you guys are doing it because you want to see her or "just for show." Now imagine how she would feel if all of a sudden you refuse to let your siblings fly her out to visit them.

I wanted you to put yourself in that situation and try to understand the situation and see how a parent feels. Instead, you avoided it by replying with this....

Couldn't "Imagine" anything remotely close to doing things for her "just for show" as we all know how much she has sacrificed for us so the very least we can do is return as much of the genuine love back to her as possible. As hard as we try, I don't think we could ever repay her 100 percent.

And also couldn't "imagine" anything remotely close to "refuse to let your siblings...." as we all love her the same and visit her as much as possible so that thought is not even on our mind. She has also express how lucky of a mother she is but we are actually the lucky ones to have her raised and guide us. Very thankful, my siblings and I are not going through the family drama my friend and his family is going through..

You immediately went into defense mode and started defending you and your siblings, going way off my point.

To summarize...
1. Your friend told you his situation.
2. Without having all the FACTS about the situation, you come up with an ignorant conclusion based on your own personal view.
3. Next, you gave your friend bad advice based on you and your view,  disregarding the FACT that this situation/problem is between your friend and his family
4. When your advice was criticized for being a bad one, you failed to come up with good sound arguments defending why your advice isn't bad.
5. After failing to defend your bad advice, you refuse to accept responsibility for it.


« Last Edit: March 17, 2019, 12:24:03 AM by dogmai »

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Offline dogmai

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #41 on: March 17, 2019, 12:00:16 AM »
theking,

Nobody is perfect,  we all make mistakes.  It's whether you are willing to take responsibility for your actions or not. So far, it looks like you may become the newest member of the club that you hate so much.



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Offline dogmai

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #42 on: March 17, 2019, 12:13:43 AM »
Btw,

Before you start accusing me, I don't claim nor did I claim that "faking" is ok. My argument is in regards to your bad advice.



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #43 on: March 17, 2019, 01:52:41 AM »
First of all, you just buried your whole argument. Second, FACTS beat ignorance. Third, you are the one that don't fully understand what "reading comprehension" means or you're just dismissing what I have presented. Reading comprehension is not just about being able to read the words or know their definition. Being able to understand the meaning of what is written down plays a big part.
 

Instead of getting all the FACTS from all the people involved, you made an ignorant claim based on your view.
[/color]

Show me the "comment" of yours that I've avoided...I bet nothing just like the made up "he's refusing to let his siblings visit their parents" BS claim...talk about "missing the whole point"...

:2funny:  :2funny: LMAO After all those fails, you decided to copy the Hmong Notrodomus, resulting in another failure.


Bad news for you, because you just lost the bet.  :2funny:

My comment.
I wanted you to put yourself in that situation and try to understand the situation and see how a parent feels. Instead, you avoided it by replying with this....

You immediately went into defense mode and started defending you and your siblings, going way off my point.

To summarize...
1. Your friend told you his situation.
2. Without having all the FACTS about the situation, you come up with an ignorant conclusion based on your own personal view.
3. Next, you gave your friend bad advice based on you and your view,  disregarding the FACT that this situation/problem is between your friend and his family
4. When your advice was criticized for being a bad one, you failed to come up with good sound arguments defending why your advice isn't bad.
5. After failing to defend your bad advice, you refuse to accept responsibility for it.

As expected, nothing just like the made "refusing to let the siblings visit the parents" ignorant claim...all that rambling and tantruming and nothing...

As far as your "comment" goes, I already answered it a few posts back but given your reading comp issues, I'm not surprised you missed it too...WHAT AN EPIC "FAIL" you are...

That's just how it is when you make up stuff and can't back it up when challenged...a gain what an EPIC "FAIL"!!!



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Offline theking

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Re: How do you feel about this especially those that are the last child
« Reply #44 on: March 17, 2019, 01:57:36 AM »
theking,

Nobody is perfect,  we all make mistakes.  It's whether you are willing to take responsibility for your actions or not. So far, it looks like you may become the newest member of the club that you hate so much.

You made the mistake of making up stuff...all I see is tantrum from you as there's nothing to back up the ignorant claim accusing me 'telling my friend to refused his siblings visiting their parents'...Just for that, you are an EPIC "FAIL" and until you either find the fact evidence to back up your made up claim or owned up to your "mistake", and learn from it, you WILL continue to be an EPIC "FAIL"...



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